Nobody Realizes How Much Money is on LinkedIn...

What's the difference between LinkedIn and the other social platforms? >> We look at income. Average income on LinkedIn is well, let's look at the other platforms. They range anywhere from 50 to I think like $70,000 for like either Twitter or Instagram or Facebook. LinkedIn's average income is a little bit over $130,000 a year. So, it's almost double the average income of other platforms. Number two, 50% or more of the people on LinkedIn currently have a college degree or higher. So, now we're talking to an educated audience. And last but not least, four out of the five people that are on that platform are business decision makers. That's just talking about LinkedIn. We're not even getting into the AI aspect of what LinkedIn means in this AIdriven world right now. >> So when you post, are you doing any kind of CTA in your post or you just hoping they hit your little icon and go to your page? >> Dan Sullivan and Joe Polish were some amazing clients of mine. We actually used the same qualifying question. Do you consider yourself an entrepreneur or a business owner with an entrepreneurial mindset? I'm not asking, do they make seven figures? You ask financial questions, people are like, "Okay, this person's pitching." I'm asking them as a quote unquote expert. Hey, I want your opinion. I want your expertise. You're watching Marketing Misfits with Norm Ferrar and Kevin K. >> It's a stare off. Who's going to say something? >> Norm is waiting. Norm is waiting. Like, who's going to say something first? Who's going to say something first? Well, I was just, you know, because the average podcast, we just found out people only listen to 9 minutes. So, I was just like, might as well take up the first minute of just silence. >> Well, that was my example. I wasn't saying that. >> Yeah. >> So, our guest today, he's like, damn, I got to get everything I got to say into the first nine minutes cuz nobody else going to be listening after that. >> No, we're just going to invite him to the stir off. >> He just went into the stir off. That That could be fun. >> There we go. So, how are you, Mr. King? >> I'm good. I'm good. Um, I guess I'm going to be seeing you here shortly. Uh, and well, this podcast is coming out after I saw you, but you're you're coming down to my neck of the woods to have a cigar and a Coke Zero. >> And I had a great time, by the way. >> You had a great time. Well, we're going to we're going to put this on the vision board and like pre pre-do it, right? Yeah. >> You had a great time going to Mark's birthday dinner. You had a great time getting massage. You had Coke Zeros, like unlimited of Coke Zeros and the best cigars >> and untraining your new pup, Kona. >> You and and seeing and meeting Kona. That's right. >> And untraining her. That's going to be fantastic. >> Untraining her. That's why you did untrain. You did untrain her. You kept giving her all these uh Kobe beef snacks. >> Exactly. So, we have a guest today. That's pretty cool. If you're on LinkedIn or if you've never been on LinkedIn and trying to >> That was me. >> Who? >> I was not on LinkedIn two years ago. >> Oh, that's right. Okay. >> Remember our buddy Winfred Winfred from the Netherlands tried to get me to get on LinkedIn years ago. I'm like, "No, I'm busy over here on this Facebook uh thing." And I wasn't really a big social media person. And then when I started my newsletter, all these newsletter gurus are like, "You got to be on LinkedIn. That's a great source for newsletter." that that and X. I'm like, "Okay, I I'll go on LinkedIn, I guess." So, I went on LinkedIn and I hired some girl to help me like do the stories and stuff. She's basically taking my content and just doing the grunt work and repurposing it. Now, I'm at like 13 14,000 followers. So, I'm like, "Okay, this is actually a legit channel." What's your link? You've been on LinkedIn though for quite some time, right? >> Yeah. And you know what? Josh is going to hate me saying this, but I was on I was doing really well and then I kind of went away and I was doing more of the Tik Tok and the you know the other social channels and I keep looking at it. It keep trying like it's drawing me back and I just haven't got into it. I've been building the profile but even that's out of date. So it'll be really interesting to hear what our guest has to say. Yeah, LinkedIn I found it to be a hit or miss for me. And I think our guest today is probably going to we going to have some uh good tips. We had uh the the other lady that came on the podcast earlier this year uh that's a really good LinkedIn expert as well, but I think Josh comes at from a different point of view and I think he's like rated number three in the world. What? Whoever's rating that rating the three most influential LinkedIn experts or something. Um >> that's right from where? >> Right from his wife, I think. >> Oh, okay. Okay. I think she actually said he was number one and then he he did something he didn't take out the trash or something so he slid to number three uh or something something like that. Uh but yeah, he's like he's up there. He knows his stuff and I I just saw him recently at Driven Mastermind. He he took a quick gander at my LinkedIn. He's like, "Kevin, dude, this this header graphic you have at the top has got to go. It's a pretty picture of a Tahiti, but this is doing nothing." Um and of course, I haven't taken action yet to fix that, but I I I need to. Uh, but LinkedIn has been a it's been good. I had a post just recently hit for me. This is good. I mean, 86,000 impressions. Um, that's not like our friend Joe who had 4 million or something like that on on one of hers things, >> but I'm finding and it's going to be interesting to talk to him. It's great, but I'm finding it difficult to convert people. >> Um, >> let's get them on. Let's get them on cuz we could talk we could talk forever on this. >> I know we could talk forever. Let's get on Josh. >> Let's bring on the man, >> the myth, the legend. >> There he is. >> What's up, John? >> How you doing, man? >> I'm good. I'm good. I'm excited for the conversation as I'm just sitting in the background listening. I'm like, all right. Yeah, this is Let's see where we can play this. >> Exactly. Uh so so you I I I I have to apologize first u for I I saw that you graduated from the University of Texas with a degree in marketing and I I apologize. I I'm sincerely sorry. >> Um are you an Aggie Kevin? >> I that how did you know? >> I mean >> it's okay. I mean like if it makes you feel any better growing up I had I wanted to go to&M cuz they had a good basketball team. and I played basketball before I actually played football. And so I had&M's logo, my dad painted&m, Texas&M's logo on my wall on my bedroom for most of my middle and high school. So it didn't then I just decided I mean like look be honest I originally went to Nacka nowhere and if no one knows where that is >> play football and then I realized that I'm I'm not that big and I'm not that great to play football and this is not going to be a career. So I left and went to Austin. All right, I I'll forgive you. I'll forgive you then. You came from the East East Texas Sticks and and moved on up to Austin. Uh so I I I'll forgive you. >> And I'm Canadian, so I'm sitting here going, >> "Who the hell cares about college football?" Like, we have a college our championship game. You have family and friends come out. >> That's like That's like SFA. >> Yeah. Norm literally go to and go watch, if you remember the old movie, Varsity Blues. Yeah. >> Um, and let me tell you, like that's how my high school was grow. I mean, like I I now have arthritis in my left knee because I had like what's called like oscar's disease where I had a chip bone in my knee and they would literally give me a cortisone shot every other game to make sure I could play. >> Like that's not legal. You shouldn't do that. But that's Texas football, right? And and now I get to walk with a limp. >> It's serious business down here at at all levels at from high school on up. Uh it's there's a high school here in Austin, uh West Lake or Lake Travis that has like a$80 million dollar stadium or something like that. >> Oh, it's it's insane. >> We We could talk uh Texas football all day. Norman, you got to pull us off this topic. >> Okay. Save us, Nor. Save us. Save us. Save us. >> Josh, I hear you do something. Can you tell us a little bit about what you do? You do something, you know? I mean, and I heard you guys drop the words like LinkedIn guru and LinkedIn expert. Honestly, I I hate those words. Um, you know, I I never want to be an expert because I mean, like at an expert level, like I don't know, at a certain point like it's like, oh, I'm I'm an expert and like I've learned everything like no, I'm a constant learner, right? Like and and that's the whole piece like LinkedIn is an amazing platform. Um, just like you said, Norm, you know, you you were on there and then you got off. I mean, dude, it's been around for 20 almost 22 years now. So, like of course we've all gotten on and gotten off and you know it's it's it's that shift and for me I started about 11 years ago and you know my background is not in LinkedIn specifically. Um I one of my first clients was MySpace right like back in 03 that was my first client. I helped them design one of the first social media ads. So I spent a lot of time monetizing traffic. I was really good at it. Uh but then I realized like well I don't know if I was actually helping people. So, LinkedIn was that platform that just like y'all probably seen, a lot of people spam. Um, and it's just I think there's a better way to be able to do it. And then there's an amazing um group of human beings that are actually on that platform because they're not going on LinkedIn to lose themselves in someone else's life like they do on Tik Tok or Facebook because they go they fall in these holes like, "Oh, I want to watch someone else's life." They go to LinkedIn to be able to either get educated or to be able to learn to make how to make a decision, right, for what they're doing for their business or for themselves. And so what I really took was how do I actually not be like all the LinkedIn experts out there and teach you how to spam a thousand people to get the one sale where you just piss off 999 people, but how do we actually go back to that that human aspect of how we connect and how do we actually start a conversation to build a relationship? Because in today's world, relationships create opportunities. And so that's where I started using it. And like the things that I do honestly y'all, it's just the things that my mom taught me how to treat other human beings. I'm just doing online. Like you can use it on any platform. LinkedIn just just I decided to be the best in the world. I said, "Look, I'm going to go all in and I want to be the best in the world at this platform." That's just my vehicle. So that's that's what I get to do. Hey, Norm, do you know any sellers out there that are just burned out during this uh ecom game? >> You know, I I know a lot of people that have talked to us, you know, when we go to events, and it's not only that, they don't know where to start. >> And who would you recommend they talk to? >> The first one that comes to mind is is Quiet Light Brokerage. And here's why. They're going to build you up. They're going to understand your company. And at the end of the day, you're going to know how to maximize your valuation. So, the very first thing you need to do is go and get your free confidential evaluation at quietllight.com. They're going to ask a couple questions. Uh you're going to meet up. It's one- on-one with uh somebody over there and then, you know, let the games begin. >> Awesome. What was that website again? >> It's quiet.com. >> Awesome. I'm going to head over there. What's the difference between LinkedIn and the other social platforms? >> Well, here's here's three like key metrics like depending on if we're talking to marketers, right? Which marketing misfits, right? Marketers like, okay, well, you know, what are my three my key triggers? Well, we look at income, average income on LinkedIn is, well, let's look at the other platforms. They range anywhere from 50 to I think like $70,000 for like either Twitter or Instagram or Facebook. LinkedIn's average income is a little bit over $130,000 a year. So it's almost double the average income of other platforms. Number two, the a 50% or more of the people on LinkedIn currently have a college degree or higher. So now we're talking to an educated audience. And last but not least, four out of the five people that are on that platform are business decision makers. So, when we talk about this, I now have someone that has the means to make a decision to pay for whatever I'm offering, has the ability to understand what they're buying and be educated enough to be able to do it and can pull the trigger and say, "Yes, I can do this." For me, that's a win-winwin. And the visibility, like Kevin, you were talking about right now, it's been going through the roof. And that's just talking about LinkedIn. We're not even getting into the AI aspect of what LinkedIn means in this AIdriven world right now. Yeah, it's huge. I mean, LinkedIn's become like a major source uh at it and Reddit uh in particular. They become major major sources uh for feeding AEO and and all that. But what LinkedIn started >> back in the day, like you said, 20ome years ago, it was almost like a monster.com or kind of like it was like it was a place to like for jobs like to to get a job. >> And that still that still runs probably a huge I most of their revenue. I mean, like, look, people are still going on there, but there's another opportunity. I think that's the problem, Kev. Right. Like, because people are going, "Oh, that's where I go to find someone to work for me or find a job, and it's become so much more." >> It has. I didn't realize that when I was not on it until like two years ago, and I saw that, especially in the Amazon world that Noran and I play uh play in most of the time, there's a ton of content on there, a ton of people sharing good stuff. Uh uh and and you know, yeah, there's the spamming where I get the messages like, "Hey, I see you sell on Amazon. I'd love to talk to you about it sometime." You know, like come on now, you didn't look at anything. Uh you know, there there is that aspect that I just ignore, but there's a lot of valuable stuff there. >> Oh, dude. And like you were talking about newsletters, like Norm, I'm not sure if you played around on newsletters yet for LinkedIn, but we've found that's the fastest piece of content getting indexed by Google today. Like when I do a newsletter, that piece of that newsletter is getting indexed by Google within an hour. >> Wow. >> Like come on. Like that's huge. I mean, Norm, you you say you haven't been on a while, but I guarantee you if I if I Googled your name, >> you're one of the top three results for your name is going to be your LinkedIn profile. >> That's right. It is. >> Yep. >> And that's that's for everybody. If you ever because it's such a it's a the ma score of how they do SEO, which we all know that SEO I hate to use the words going away. It's just changing to AEO like Kevin said, but you know it is a 100 out of 100 on the MOS score and so like it's super I mean like I can take Kevin's article and I can put it on LinkedIn and I can actually I'll find the article on LinkedIn before I will find it on his own blog and you don't get dinged like we used to before like oh you can't pay post the same content everywhere because of that moncore it doesn't affect you. So, it's actually better to take that same piece of content and repurpose it or re repost it on LinkedIn again just to get the extra visibility. >> Is that as a regular post or as a newsletter post? >> Um, it's a news So, I I do it as a newsletter because you can do articles, but why not have LinkedIn email your audience of everyone that subscribes? I mean, they have 100% deliverability. Like, we don't have to worry about Google, you know, catching it in the spam folder because we said something wrong. And I mean these days, I think Kevin, you and I looked at it while we were at Driven, but I mean most of the clients we work with, we're seeing anywhere from 20 to 50% open rates on the emails that LinkedIn are sending out to the people that subscribe to their LinkedIn newsletters. >> Yeah, I was having my girl uh she just uh went on to another job and quit doing LinkedIn a month ago. So, I haven't it's kind of off last month. I haven't done it, but she was taking my real newsletter that I called the real newsletter, the email newsletter, >> and she was putting a truncated version of it as a newsletter on there and and then it would be like a a half of it or something say for the rest of it subscribe. That wasn't working. But then I I had never gone and looked at any of the statistics and when you showed me a driven like, hey, go here, go here, go here and look at these numbers. I was like I was actually surprised uh at it was into the thousands. I'm like, so that's extra reach >> that I'm getting from my advertisers, getting from my my stuff that I'm not getting. Um, and and I need to go back and just start basically just copying and pasting my beehive and making maybe some modifications based on what you might tell me and just throwing it in there and reaching a huge percentage because isn't it when you do a newsletter, it it it also notifies like the other audience. They get a notification on LinkedIn. >> 14,000 or whatever, whatever number I have, they get a notification too, right? >> Not notify them and email them. So, I mean like >> Oh, it emails I thought it only emails the people that had subscribed to the newsletter. >> Well, it notifies the people, but sorry. Yes, it emails the people that subscribe, but it also notifies your entire audience. So, like that. And anytime someone reaches out to connect right now, Kevin, even if you don't connect with them, they automatically get an invite to subscribe to your newsletter. >> They do. So, if you connect just through your profile, >> they would get >> So, if I sent Norm, Norm, you and I have been connected for a while, but if I was like, "Hey, I want to connect with Norm and you had a newsletter." >> Even if I even if you don't accept, I'm going to get an invitation. Hey, do you want to subscribe to Norm's newsletter? >> Really? >> So, for for y'all, too, like if you don't have it already, and I I'm sorry I didn't look, but you should have a marketing misfits page, like a company. >> We have it with nothing on it. Just our faces start >> taking these podcasts. We we do it for our clients that have podcasts. And I mean the cool thing is you can embed a video, you can embed audio. I mean so like however people like you know we have some people that read the book, we got other people that listen to the audio and then you got half the world now the the the younger generation they just wait till the movie comes out and we're half of us are like dude that movie sucked. It had nothing to do with the book. But that's how people you know take in information. So like you can do the newsletter that same way. You can take everything y'all are doing for this podcast and we see a massive uptick in in views, visibilities, and downloads of the podcast when you launch when the new episode goes out, you also pop out a newsletter from the company page >> because you can embed YouTube into into the newsletter. So, it actually is pulling it from YouTube itself, right? >> Yeah, exactly. >> And they can click the button, the old YouTube thing, and it takes them over to YouTube. um which then helps you with your views and whatever stuff on on on >> and that that's we're doing a newsletter for this podcast and um it's I'm doing some prototyping right now on it. Um and it's going to be coming out here soon. >> Yeah, I I actually have a prototype, Norm. >> Oh my >> in between webinars and everything else. I actually can fit that in, >> believe it or not. But uh but it it's uh we're we're doing that. So, we'll have something like that. But there's some some other things like you don't want to send traffic to a YouTube video within the first two weeks. And so, there's some other um things that can mess up algorithm plays. But, so on LinkedIn though, there's a guy Robert somebody that's I I get uh I forget his last name now. He's a big LinkedIn guy. >> Something. Yeah, something like that. And he he has like a book that I don't think it's him, but yeah. >> Not Kiasaki. No, Robert. Sorry. It's with a K though. Um, Robert something. He has a a LinkedIn guide like, "Okay, here we studied everything and you need don't post uh, you know, always make sure you you don't put a >> talking about Richard." >> Richard, that's it. Sorry. Richard Vander. >> That's exactly Richard. Yeah, that's exactly. >> Um, >> yeah, Richard's great. I mean, like, look, I the amount of information time that he goes through to dissect everything >> is insane, >> you know? Um, and I highly recommend looking at a lot of his stuff. At the same time too, if you're always trying to, and this is the biggest thing that I've looked at, y'all, it's like, if I'm always trying to beat or game the algorithm, I'm always going to have to look for the next trick. I'm always going to have to find the next hack. But if I actually just pay attention to the one algorithm that that doesn't change and just evolves extremely slowly over time, the human algorithm, it just continues to work. So, I don't have to keep on worrying about stats. I just understand how to be able to connect with human beings. Just my just my perspective, right? But don't get me wrong. I read all richer stuff. >> Well, I'll get a post that'll go if I don't get a thousand 2,000 impressions. I usually consider that a failure on on LinkedIn on on on something that I post. And sometimes I'll even go and delete it. I'll go delete something that has 117 impressions. I'm like, why? This is a really good story. Why did it not go and this other one goes to 20,000? That's a stupid story. Um it so and I'm not trying to necessarily game it um or or anything and it's just it's like it's frustrating. That's that's why I like email and that's why like I want to get every single person on LinkedIn on on my email list. Just give me your email and I got you. U but I'm having I'm having a hard time even though it's view newsletter in the it's in the bio thing. It's in the when we post stuff it's like hey this is from the newsletter. Subscribe here and put it in the comments. We waited the 5 minutes or 10 minutes or whatever it is and then we put it tried all the little things and and I think in the two years I've gotten 500 people total um from LinkedIn uh to 535 I think last time I checked um that are sourced directly from LinkedIn. That's not good. >> So let's let's talk about this. Let's go down that rabbit hole because I think there's a lot of people, a lot of listeners out there >> that have no clue about posting this newsletter into LinkedIn. So, >> yeah, >> is it viable? Is it worth it? Is it worth the time to to set up your newsletter in uh in LinkedIn? And how do you do it? >> I mean, look y'all, this is the thing. Is it is it viable? 100%. I mean, like I think you're missing out. I mean, this is something that I was um telling Perry, you know, a couple years ago. I mean, he was, you know, really pushing newsletters big. I said, "Look, man, there's an opportunity for more visibility to be able to go in with newsletters because of the indexing, right? Like now you're not only getting potentially found on LinkedIn, you can also get found on Google. And even more so, like when Kevin, when you're talking about deleting posts, like that's a that's a that's you're removing a touch point of indexing. I'm like, I leave everything up because I'm not thinking about currently right now. I want to make sure I'm the future of because LinkedIn's the future, not only the future of business, but the future of search because Microsoft owns LinkedIn. Microsoft also owns OpenAI. Let's just be real. We all know that. They can play around and get behind all they want. >> Yeah. And so they're using and I've been on the inside with LinkedIn. They have over the last year and a half they've been using LinkedIn as the basis for their generative search because we are moving to AEO because we are moving to zero click that's why all these pieces of content especially like the newsletters that's long form content which we know AI likes to be able to source and be able to go through why not put it in there why not have that opportunity to be able to come up as the answer not only on LinkedIn not only as goo not only on Google but also in you know co-pilot and chat GPT when people are searching and that's the way they're they're moving things. So, yes, 100% because I can't post my YouTube video on LinkedIn. I can take clipets because you want to do it natively, but I can post my YouTube video, like Kevin said, within my newsletter if I want to be able to have multiple sources of indexing. The three main pieces of places to index outside of Reddit are LinkedIn. when you're talking about if we go back to original SEO are LinkedIn, YouTube and Pinterest, right? Those are those are three search engines that are highly highly leveraged if leveraged correctly, you get highly indexed on Google. So that's how we're actually using newsletters, Norm, is being able to go through and we're being able to tell a story and adding value, not just talking about what we can do. I want when you're writing a newsletter, you need to be able to tell someone how to do it. And I think that's the biggest thing, how to do it within a story, giving relevance and using multimedia within that newsletter to be able to build into your audience. And I can on on any social platform, if you link off site, and I don't care if these social platforms tell you that's wrong. Like LinkedIn's like, "Oh, you can link off our site all day all all day long." I haven't seen it. When you link off site, they ding you, right? They want you to stay in their on their island and but on the newsletters I can do a CTA. I can pull off platform and so that's how we do it. Kevin like and I looked at one of your newsletters was real small like man we're at the bottom of the newsletter you'll see a huge image of one of my newsletters has a big picture that's clickable because I can actually turn it clickable that pushes people they can't miss it at the bottom of the newsletter to jump off platform and >> text link down there people can miss right now. Yeah, it needs some love. Uh, actually tonight I'm actually going to go to go. I've never played with it. I had that person doing it. So, I'm going to go in there tonight, take my last newsletter from a couple from yesterday and actually put it in there and just figure out figure it out. >> Yeah. But and and Norm, you were saying like it was like how do you do a newsletter? on your LinkedIn profile on the desktop, you'll go into you'll click what's called it says write article when you're in your posting section and then the top right hand corner it's going to say create newsletter and it'll you'll go to it'll say manage here. Y'all want me to share my screen? >> Yeah, go ahead. You just have to describe it. >> I didn't know where to go. I'm like I'm trying to be as descriptive as possible. I'm like h that's that's always fun too when I try and do a LinkedIn presentation uh you know on stage and they're like no slides. I'm like man it's sometimes it's a little difficult to >> um go through and and and do that. So all right here is let's just go to window LinkedIn feed. All right. Can y'all see my my LinkedIn right now? >> Not yet. >> Not yet. >> Not yet. Okay. >> Now well something started. There it goes. There. >> Now we see it. >> God says Oh, right here. Write article. >> Where? >> Click that. >> Where was that? Write article. >> Okay. So, go back. Here's the top page. Right here. You got video, photo, or >> art. Okay. Yeah. >> We're going to click there. You're going to go to manage. And then I've already got one. But, and this is the cool thing, y'all. Every profile, even every business profile, you can create up to four newsletters. So, like people that are really trying to build out their AEO, like they're going to be creating newsletters all day long, right? And fill in the information because you can, right? You're sourcing, you're setting up the source code for AEO and where it's going. So, like you just hit create newsletter, add a news title, how often do you want to post? I do mine twice a month. um add your newsletter description, upload an image, and then when you hit that button, all your connections will be subscribed. Well, they'll they'll be get an notification to subscribe. >> But putting the content, can I cut and paste? Like since I'm multi cut and paste from beehive and it formats it, I got to go in there and it's a whole different type of formatting and different fields and different it works just like a text editor. >> It is. That's all it is. I mean, it's got all the different aspects in here to be able to go through and do. I mean, I can cut, copy, paste. I mean, like, it can take in two seconds to be able to take what you've got and go through. And I mean, I I'll show you some of my >> links then, too, or you got to reconnect all the links. >> Um, I mine usually work um because I've already got it hyperl and stuff like that. So, it makes it super easy. You have to pull you to pull it from the beehive source inside beehive and not from a newsletter that you sent to your email because it's going to have all the UTMs and parameters. You need to pull it from the internal source. Okay, >> let me see if I can pull some of my newsletters. I just changed, man. I'm playing around with a little bit different headline. I was like, I want something more explosive and this is kind of what we came in. But, you know, you'll see we're telling a story, being able to go in. We've got different links, but you know, and different stats that are kind of going through a video like you said. I I mean, I've got a testimonial video right here, right, going in from James Williams. And then here's our event, right? So, you can see, grab your guide, but we've also made this clickable that takes you directly to our next our event that's coming up >> uh with the launch of our new podcast. So, I mean, like, I'm not doing something small. I'm making it big. I've got multiple links. save your seat. You can you can tag people. I've got my wife tagged. All these different aspects that'll take you into what we're trying to be able to do. And like what I was showing Kevin, I think this just launched, so I don't think it's going to have that much. >> Um >> where do you see how many people have opened it or or whatever. >> I'm probably my god, I probably should have shown you a better an older one because it now we're seeing visibility on LinkedIn. Two to three weeks we start seeing a new increase. So like this one had 2,000 impressions. Again, I'm not I don't get like millions of impressions on my newsletters. I I it's not about that, right? So, article views 2,000, email send 7,000. So, on this one, >> yeah, but these are better. These are most likely better. These are people who are interested in you. This is a this 1300 is probably equal to 10,000 impressions on a post or something. >> Correct. >> Those I got I got drivebys and they don't even look at anything. Those are people that want to look at it. >> Exactly. And I mean, look, reactions, comments, repost, 21% email open rate, tells me my article demographics. I can go in deeper and even and now I can even adjust. Am I hitting my right audience? Do I need to change and shift on who I'm actually talking to? Like this one, recruitment, man, that's not these aren't my right job titles. So, this newsletter really hasn't really hit what I'd really want to do. Now, the seniority, right? Owner, that's what I'm looking for. director, you know. So, it gives me so much information that I can actually go back through and be able to go through. And another cool thing. Let me go to my dopamine dose and see. I can look at my view analytics as well. Um, >> here's my subscribers. Like people like, "Oh, I don't get my emails." Guess what? I can go through a message and start build a campaign out to be able to go through and connect with every single person that that follows my newsletter. You can build a a campaign outside going through. Yeah. I mean, I I have teams that go through and does this and they'll go through and they'll start going, "Hey, I saw you read Josh's recent newsletter. Just want to thank you. Hey, what was one of the pieces that you enjoyed from the last newsletter?" >> So, you're you're individually going and messaging them. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> And I mean, it works really, really well. So that >> or you may see someone there you want to connect with you know like in our case maybe it's Amazon's business development person >> and I can reach out to oh look they they're reading the newsletter and let me reach out to them and sell them a sponsorship or sell them whatever. >> Um >> exactly. So, so when the new like today I posted a story from my newsletter this morning, just a single story. I just took that story and posted as a just a normal post >> before this call. It been up for like I don't know maybe two an hour and a half. It had 113 impressions >> which is not great and like three or four comments below it. But if I I I should have what you're saying instead of posting that as a just a little post I should have just put the whole newsletter with that included in there. would have probably done quite a bit better >> probably. And the same time, I mean, it all depends on the level of content, right? Like >> this is LinkedIn is not >> Tik Tok, it's not Instagram. They're not spending hours a day on it, right? So, our posts, >> you want to keep them short, you know? Um, if it's really long content, Yeah. you want a newsletter because you want the people that are already bought in. >> Yeah. >> Right. Because we It's been around for 21 years. Half of us probably half of our connections we don't have, we don't even know who they are. And that's the whole thing like the difference between LinkedIn and every other platform out there is every other platform is pushing to your for you page. So your most of the people that see your content first are the people that they the system believes will like your content. LinkedIn is different. LinkedIn actually shows your content to your connections first. And this is why I tell people all the time like go through your connections de it's not a numbers game. If you listen to someone like Gary Vee, he'll tell you you can have 5,000 connections on LinkedIn and get more opportunity create more opportunity than than a million followers on Instagram. >> So I I've got a question about that. >> Probably a year ago, two years ago, I had a lot of old connections, mostly Asia, and I just went through and I probably deleted about 3,000 people. And open network, you know, got rid of them. So, yeah, that took out 3,000 people out of my my contacts right now that are garbage for well that I'm not going to engage with. >> Do you recommend doing something like that? Like, should I go through it again? >> I do it all the time because again, that's what they're looking for, right? They're looking for that first hour or two. Is the audience if you is your people that you're connected to and going to engage before they share it out? So, if you have people that have nothing to do with you, they never engage. Like, they're going to stay followers, right? When you disconnect with them, they're still following you. They're just not your connection because you only get 30,000. So, why not disconnect the people that you you don't add value to and they don't add value to you, right? It's got to be a mutual thing. >> You only get 30,000 >> 30,000 connections. You can have billions of followers, >> but someone if you accept a connection, it makes them a follower, right? >> Correct. But so the connections I get a ton per day. I get 10, 15, 20, 30. Sometimes >> they're all following you >> and and they it's in there and I got to approve them, you know, accept except >> they automatically follow you. So LinkedIn makes them automatically. >> I find about twothirds of them. I look at the description and there's some I don't want to get racist or anything, but there's there's some things that people from certain countries and stuff that clearly are not in my market. Um, and or maybe they maybe I they are because they keep trying to follow me. But I keep I I delete those because I I've heard somewhere maybe there this Richard guy that >> no keep that clean like Norm was saying that that's going to determine and maybe that's why a post that's 86 what goes 86,000 is it just luck of the draw >> hit the first 100 or 200 people were like dialed in and it just starts spreading it more versus another post >> it hit just the luck of the the numbers that came up and the my followers it hit the the bad section uh which wasn't as engaged because it was somebody that's a concrete truck driver that's on my list or something that has no interest in Amazon. >> Oh yeah. I mean y'all I hit my 30,000 a long time ago and I deleted probably at least half of them and then you know started back again. >> What determines how you delete them? Like when Norm you can answer that too. I mean what what Nor did you decide who to delete and how what would you recommend Joshua deciding who to delete? >> Well for me every time someone cold pitches me they're gone. >> You know you cold pitch me. >> Yep. we're we're we're you're dead. And honestly, half the time, too, like if you just turn on the anniversaries or the birthdays and you're like, I don't know who this person is. I delete them. You know, LinkedIn makes it easy. They have so many notifications you can turn on that when you start getting these anniversaries and birthdays and everything else that go through and you're like, who is this person? It's it's gone. Right. So, that's how I did it. I know Norm, you sit a little bit differently. >> Yeah. No, I'll just go through anybody and everybody uh and just start clicking if if they don't look like they're part of my network. Well, why are you there? And same thing, I probably get around the same 10 to 20 uh new connections or new people reaching out every day. I always go in. I always kind of okay if they message me I'll I definitely will take a look to see what they're saying. Um but a lot of times even the messaging is just a automated message. So just gone gone gone gone gone. I might out of >> 20 maybe keep two you know but they've got to be specific. I've I've tightened it up. It used to be just numbers. Oh it was so great I had you know x number of uh people. Now it's just click click click click click, you know. Same thing with Facebook. Same thing with Facebook. >> Yeah. Well, Facebook, man, I I I used to be I was so excited when I hit my 5,000 connections over there. Now I'm just annoyed because it's like every time I turn around Yep. >> I've got a You go to an event, you're like, "Man, I want to connect with my buddy." And then I call it deleting the dead people. So when I'm at 5,0002 and the same thing happens, somebody I want to connect with and it's like, "You can't add anybody else." I'm like, "Ah." So, I go in there and just go into the whole list and I just The first thing I do is look for the ones with no picture. So, I just scroll through. If there's no picture, that's an instant delete. >> No mutual friends. >> That means they or yeah, if it's one or two mutual friends or something, that's usually a delete, too. Um, >> guys, here's the other way to do it, too. >> With a certain character or a certain word or something, sometimes those get deleted, too, if you know what I You know, a big one for me is I there's certain people in the industry that accept everybody and if they come up, if I see their icon as one of their members, >> click, click, click, click. I'm out 100%. >> Oh, yeah. >> Well, the other way to do it, y'all, is so you got LinkedIn has their built-in CRM system, Sales Navigator. Yeah. >> A lot of people don't leverage that, but it's it's it's so powerful because you do not have to advertise on LinkedIn to get massive visibility. if you do it right and and honestly if you are advertising on LinkedIn you better have some deep pockets because you're competing against the Fortune 100 companies out there right so um I mean anyone that comes to us like hey can you help us with advertising I'm like how's your organic first right like let's be but like sales navigator all the features that we a lot of those features that we lost on Facebook for targeting you still have on LinkedIn and one way to be able to delete people is because again I want to make sure I've got active people because again I've said it like 15 times been around for 21 years. So there's a lot of people that created and and ghosted and and went away. So you can use sales network and say which of my first degree connections posted in the last 30 days. It'll create you a list of everyone that has posted. Right? So now you can see like oh well I've got like me. I've almost got 50,000 connections. Well only 20,000 of my connections posted last last in the last 30 days. All right. Well, that's probably a good estimate that 30,000 of my connections are never active. And so why do I even have them? I might as well clear that up. >> And can you do that in one swoop in the navigator or do you have to go manually? You have to go manually. >> You can't. You go manually. >> How do you know which? >> I I I never never ever ever ever use any automation, Kevin, because it goes against LinkedIn's T's and C's because it's like they're looking. So, like there's all these automation automation tools on LinkedIn and like they if you ever watch them, they update every night because what they're doing is they're trying to stay ahead of LinkedIn's code because you're not supposed to be using it. If you get caught, you'll lose your entire LinkedIn profile. And like now, because they have OpenAI on the back end, I'm seeing people get caught within like an hour they're finding to be able to find automation. So, these it's it's just a battle of AI trying to find out who's who's trying to spam and and how do we kick them off the platform, right? And so the only thing I've I'll ever use a a tool is for um I have one tool that I've used only to be able to remove connections. And it's a tool you go in there and it says remove any of my connections that have not posted in the last 30 days and it just starts cutting them out. >> What's the name of what's the name of that? >> I think it's like uh I think what am I using up there? Like link helpers or something. Like the problem is don't use any other features. If you use the other features, you're risking your entire account. >> Okay? >> But like like here's the thing, y'all. Like and I know I know you're so I just want to finish the close this loop on this because with automation like here's the thing guys. Marketers I'm a marketer love marketers but we ruin a lot of things for a lot of people um because we find the holes. We exploit them until we get caught and then everyone else loses. And that's with LinkedIn, right? like marketers like, "Oh, let me figure out how to I can send a million invites and then I'll just take whoever's left, right?" And and I'll win. Well, that's why LinkedIn now limits everyone to no more than, you know, 400 connection requests a month. And so, this is what I kind of look at everyone, I go, why do I need automation if I've only got 400 connection requests a month? That means I get a 100red a week. That means 20 a day. I can't have an EA or even myself take the time to find the 20 people a day to connect with that are actually of value. I don't need to pay automation or risk my account for that. Just saying. 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No, I I think it was 500. >> I think it was around there. And then I got a warning that came up from LinkedIn. Uh I forget what it said, but it was along the lines is that uh we've >> maybe thought it was your bot. >> You got to slow it down. Maybe you're just doing it too fast at the same time. Like delete like a I I think you only hit those limits when you do it too fast within a 24-h hour time period because they're going again. They're looking for that automation. >> Yeah. So like even like a tool like I use it's it okay here's the ones we're going to only do a hundred actions a day and we're going to slowly remove them right and so that's what it's it wasn't so you you weren't really hitting a deletion >> I think it's a suspicious activity >> correct you were hitting you were doing too much activity at this same thing if I if my team goes in or I'm going in and I'm like I just get on this whole huge commenting um ring if I do too many comments all of a sudden I can't comment anymore because they're like you've and you're too active on our platform. Like, you know, you can't you can't be active anymore. I'm like, come on, man. I I'm a power user. I want to because I'm seeing like Kevin, you talk about, you know, visibility. I I'm seeing they're now showing you what your visibility on comments are. Um, to be able to go through that's powerful, man. If I if I comment on one of your posts that my understanding is then they will test one of my post to somebody in your audience. Right. >> Correct. But they'll also and that's the whole thing. So like I have one right now. I did a um I did a like there's people that have like you know the the the crazy high you know influencers are on LinkedIn. You Bill Gates of course but uh like Ariana Huffington right? And I commented on I comment on her posts or Gary Vee or Tony Robbins, something like that. And one of my Ariana posts um I commented on I think the last time I looked has almost 200,000 views of my comment. H >> wow. >> That's let me tell you Kevin, you said like oh the average person on LinkedIn only gets a couple hundred views. So like by me getting and now my I'm showing all my comments on the right power users behind them. I'm getting thousands of views on those comments and it's bringing more opportunity to me. So like I want people to stop thinking inside the box of post in this visibility. LinkedIn's a give and get platform, right? We comment at least four or five comments before we post and then we comment on four or five people our ideal audience or the people that actually have our ideal audience on their posts because that shows that gives more breath of visibility. LinkedIn's like, "Oh, Kevin and Norm are doing exactly what we they're giving on the platform and adding value. Let's let's bring more value to them." And so that's most people post and ghost. They post and they lead the platform. >> Like you want to be able to you want to, you know, amp the engine, you know, and then get it get it warmed up. And then you want to be able to also give back after your post. >> So this post I put this morning, that's what I that's what I did. I posted it and ghosted it. Uh, so I I should have gone and posted on I don't know if Norm was active on something of his or yeah, pick a few people that are strategic or whatever and go make a comment and then post my >> my post >> and then do a couple more comments after that. >> Some other people and comment or do I wait the five or 10 minutes and comment? So some people say you need to engage with the people that comment on you. Let those first group in that first hour, you know, four, five, 10, whatever the number is, they start commenting. you should actually reply back to them because that helps the algorithm show that you're you're >> It does, but I mean, you could wait till the 58th minute and go back and comment back. I mean, like you you don't have to do it within the first 5 minutes. You do want to be able to respond back to the people that engage in your post in the first hour to two hours. Um, and like these are all, but that's not going to make or break you, right? Like it's good. It's great. That's that's called conversation. And and this the problem is you want to keep the more you have back and forth in those comments, the more better visibility too because the they they have what's called an SSI score, a social selling index score. It's the basis of like the LinkedIn's algorithm and it kind of looks for a couple things. Um and the one of those is engaging with insights, not just hey Kevin, great post. It's not an insight. That's that's just like adding more noise to a very over over loud, you know, world that we're in right now with AI. Um, but if you go in and Kevin, you add something to Norm like, "Oh, Norm, dude, I love the podcast we were on." Like, what do you think was the biggest takeaway we had from that from that that guest that came on when Josh was on and then he responds back and then you respond back? That shows you're having conversation around the post. That means there's there's more depth to the probably post and they want to show it to more people. >> So when you post Yeah. When you post, you said like that the Huffington one that got 200,000. >> Yeah. >> Are you doing any kind of CTA in your post or you just hoping that out of those 200,000 a thousand of them are curious like what's this Joshua Lee and they hit your little icon and go to your page? >> Well, I'm not doing any CTA. I am asking like I'll ask whoever it is. I always end every po every if I make a comment I always make my give my perspective on what they shared and then ask them a question right because I'm trying to push them to jump in a conversation with me as well >> right so that's what I'm always doing and so and I'm and like that's the piece right like even though us I mean I'm going to tell you I don't think I ever go through and read comments of someone else's posts there's a lot of people in this world that do right they love Ariana Huffington so much. They're going to read every post because they're advocates of her, right? And they are they want to see if anyone's talking trash, they want to go back in and, you know, rally or whatever it might be. Well, that's that's kind of where this, right? And that's where we see that opportunity. And we will I see tons of profile views when I have that come that back. And that's why again you have to for everything we're talking about guys like if you don't take your profile and put everything you can into it and not just make it a resume but actually make it like your career journey your career story and draw people in like now we're just talking about bounce rates because now you just commented now you're putting com now you're sending messages out you're connecting with people you're doing a newsletter doing posts and they're going back to your quote unquote landing page which is your LinkedIn profile and it sucks. What about paying to be what's it called? In someone's to have a professional account helps you do something or some I I pay I don't even know what it is some small token amount a year to ask some what is that? >> I mean you have the free accounts that are going I I have I pay I think $99 a month to have access to sales navigator and it also gives me the little gold in you know premium account. What that does, it allows me to be able to see. So I I hate cold calling and I hate cold email. When I get it, I'm like, dude, like the phone rings, you're like, "Hello." No one says anything. You're like, >> "Yeah, >> it's exhausting, right?" And especially now with AI dialers and everything else. Like it's it's it's just my It's funny, too. My 16-year-old son, I I'll see him. I have all the filters. I guess I should have probably put him on his phone. He's like, "These people won't start calling me." Like he he'll just grab THE PHONE LIKE, "STOP CALLING ME. I DON'T know who you are." And I'm like, "Calm down, dude." He said, "They call me all day and they never say anything." >> I'm like, "Welcome to reality." >> Yeah. >> You know, so I don't I don't like that, right? Like, and I'm one of those marketers that like, dude, if I don't like it, why do I want to do it to somebody else? Because there's a lot of marketers like, "Wow, I don't I don't like it, but like it's going to make me money, so screw it. I'm going to do it." And so, like, I look for trigger points. I look for the trigger points I look on when I'm trying to build relationships that create opportunity on LinkedIn or did someone look at my profile. Did someone engage in my content or did my ideal audience post on LinkedIn? And the where I'm getting to with this, Kevin, is because with having that premium account for 100 bucks a month, I now get to see every single person that looked at my profile. I can actually go through and sort them, see what they do, see how they show up. Now I can reach out. And we live in a world where we've been conditioned, y'all, to our human algorithm online is to like, comment, share, post. Like, comment, share, post. That's the conditioning they want us in. So, we never leave the platform. We're just in this constant loop. And so, as marketers, we know to create some to grab attention. We have to create stop gaps in their pattern. And so, when we're already conditioned to do this without actually taking it and Norm looks at my profile and I reach out and say, "Hey, Norm, dude, I just want to take two seconds out. Say, "Thank you, man. I saw you check me out on my profile. love to find out what what why you looked me up. That creates a stop gap because we're thanking someone for something they take for granted or hey Kevin I saw you engage on my post man I just want to reach out and say thank you. Love to find out what pushed you and engage. Those are those are ways that we create opportunity right because those are stones unturned opportunity. They're looking at my content. They're looking at my profile. There's a reason. Let's find out why. Let's dig a little deeper on the outside on the other side of that Kevin by paying that $100 a month. So that's what that's that gives me visibility and everyone looking at my profile and opportunity to be able to connect with them. On the other side, those are people that are engaging with me. Now, how do I actually draw in my ideal audience? Well, I've got to find them. They're not just I can't just look up in the air and go, "Okay, I put a post up. Find me." Doesn't work that way in this world anymore. Um it's like looking up the sky and go, "Okay, can I have some money?" You can be waiting a while. you know that money tree doesn't need just you know you know drop leaves on you all day long and so using sales navigator I can identify my exact audience I can see which ones are active on LinkedIn and the average person gets less than 1% engagement on LinkedIn so and look because of how we've conditioned our audience like our clients get anywhere from 10 to 15% engagement so what we're actually doing is I'm looking those and then I'll see Kevin I saw you posted on the oh Kevin shared a a post recently it's about Josh on the sharing information on the marketing messages podcast. Hey Kevin, man, I saw your recent post on that podcast, dude. Just want to say thank you so much for adding value to the to the to the platform. I really appreciated this. So, it gives me the opportunity now because you're my ideal audience. I'm drawing you in. Now, when we connect, I can have conversation. I'm saying again, that thank you creates a stop gap in their content, right? So, I'm there's even if it's not them posting, the people that take the time they pay someone to post, they're like, "Yes, I got validation. They like my post." Because it's just one of those things, y'all. I'll shut up now, but in this world, we all post for one reason above all else. And we can say it's for branding, it's for marketing, it's to get clients, whatever it is. But first and foremost, we've been conditioned to all look for that little dopamine hit we all get when someone likes or comments on our post. Then it's everything else because we hold our breath. We put it out there. Like Kevin's like, "All right, I put the post up. I only got 100 views and four four like and you're waiting at least to get one." You're waiting for that first comment. Then it's everything else. Like Kevin, you already said like, "Oh, I you didn't say like, oh, someone messaged me and they wanted to start a conversation like I got 100 views and, you know, five likes, you know, or four comments, whatever it might be." But that's the thing. So we have to become and that's how I got the title the dopamine dealer of LinkedIn because I was explaining my process because that's what we have to do right saying thank you creates that dopamine hit for everyone that >> that allows us to build connection because dopamine without direction is insanity and that's social media but dopamine with intention creates opportunity and that's what we have to really remember. You know, one of the things that you talked about was uh using sales navigator to see who lands on your page, views your profile. >> Six years ago, like this is all prior to co >> Yeah, >> that's exactly the marketing technique I used to build my agency. So I it might have even been eight years ago, but I would I had sales navigator people landed. I would check them out and I would respond and a lot of them were Amazon or ecom sellers and I just brought them into my agency. >> No, I'm doing the same thing. I'm doing the same things I did 10 years ago. I don't have to teach new stuff. Like it's because you're sticking with the human algorithm, how how we act and interg. And that's why it worked then and that's why it still works now. So, what what is the best way to get them off of LinkedIn to get them into your email list? >> What's the DMs? >> Just DMs >> conversation. >> Yeah. I mean, we're So, everything I do is just what my mom taught me how to treat other human beings, guys. Right. So, we're going through that first trigger point, right? So, the trigger point, do they look at my profile? They engage on my content or do they post something online from my ideal audience? Reach out. one of those one of those three, not all three, but just to be clear, one of those three things, you have a VA or somebody personally, not an automation tool like you said earlier, that reaches out and says, "Thank you." And the the stuff you explained and then in there is like, "Hey, by the way, do you als you might enjoy my newsletter?" Um, if you're interested, no. What do you do? >> Nope. You've already you've already you've already because that's what they're waiting for, right? >> Kevin's like, "When can I piss?" >> But most people do. Most people That's why I'm saying this. >> That's what they That's That's why they lose. >> Yep. Exactly. So >> you haven't you haven't built a flow state because when you get many dopamine hits in a row that creates a flow state allowing us to build connection. >> So like that's where you start, right? So first is appreciate, right? Hey, I just want to say thank you >> and then we're waiting for the next trigger. The next trigger is they connect, right? That's the next trigger they've done. And so this is when everyone goes, this is my time. Join my newsletter. My mom always taught me to give someone, you know, when you meet someone new, give them a compliment, right? Yep. >> I mean, like Norm, dude, that beard is killer, man. I I I >> Oh, I got to connect with you now. >> I wish I wish I could grow a beard like that. I can only grow up. You're growing down. >> Love emoji. >> But like, so that again, it's another dopamine hit. So, but on LinkedIn, >> what I do is when I connect with someone and they connect back, the first thing I do is I endorse one of their skills. So, on the bottom of your LinkedIn profile page, you have different skills. >> And it's not me sending a message. When I hit one of those skills, LinkedIn says sends Norm a thing like, "Hey, uh, Norm, Josh just endorsed you for podcasting. Do you want to say thank you?" So, that's the next thing they're getting. And people go, "Well, how can you endorse someone that you don't know?" I'm not giving him a recommendation. I'm just endorsing a skill. And the number one rule in my house with my kids is it's nice to be nice, right? Because the average people in this world are not nice just to be nice. And so, it creates a little pattern in their head. And so, Norm goes, "Yeah, sure. Why not?" "Hey, Josh, man. Dude, thank you so much for I know we just connected, but thank you so much for, you know, endorsing me. Why? Right now, they're inviting us in. Right? They're starting the conversation. We just flipped the entire script. Not us starting the conversation, them now. I can go back in like dorm, dude. Happy to do it. Um, and then I can ask a question again. I get I'm making it about you. So, um, Dan Sullivan and Joe Polish were, you know, some amazing clients of mine and we actually used the same qualifying question for them because they both, you know, if you know the you guys know them, but I mean like if you know that world like they they're very similar in how they work and so the qualifying question we created was like >> happy to do it. Hey, quick question while I have you as I always love to understand you know people's mindset. Do you consider yourself an entrepreneur or a business owner with an entrepreneurial mindset? I'm not asking do they make seven figures? I'm not tell is business going well. Like you ask financial questions, people are like, okay, this person's pitching. I'm asking them as a quote unquote expert. Hey, I want your opinion. I want your expertise. That worked really, really well because it made people think. They go, oh, what's the difference between an entrepreneur and a business owner with an entrepreneurial mindset? Well, for them it was entrepreneur early on in business or you're an entrepreneur for 20 years. I mean, you're burning the candle at both ends. We all know that being an entrepreneur is exhausting. You know, if you're a true entrepreneur, you're you're hustling all the time. Business owner with an entrepreneural mindset, they probably have more of a growth mindset. They probably have a team. They've been doing this for longer. There's a bigger opportunity there. Or I get my silent answer C because it it happens. We we don't always cast the perfect net. I work for somebody else. And so when you ask a qualifying question that asks them around the mindset, if you understand the mindset of your true opportunity, that gives you an insight and you're making it about them. So now I can provide value based on where they are in their mind. They respond back, oh, and I'm I'm an entrepreneur. Awesome. So like with Dan Sullivan, a strategic coach, we would say, hey, love to be able to give you this, you know, PDF, right? Now we can nurture them. We can take they're not there yet. Let's nurture them. Hey, here's my free PDF. Now, Norm, guess what? I just got them on my email list. Right. Um, they're a business owner with an Hey man, I love people that think that way. I love to find out more of how you got to that thinking. Anyway, we can get you on a call with my team just to explore, you know, your thinking around that. That's just with Dan, right? Like we have other ways to be able to do it. So they would invite him on a phone call, you know, to pitch for strategic coach or we had the or the um I work for somebody else. When we were doing this with Dan, it was when he was also working with um Benjamin Hardy um and they were relaunching um who not how. And so we would do the free plus shipping. And this is why we when we work with authors, it works really well too because now I can go, oh man, totally understand. Love to be able to sing in my my my new book coming out for free. And so that's how we actually nurtured them into different opportunities. That was that situation. Most of most of what we do with our clients now, we have three different ways that we bring them in based on how they answer the qualifying question. It's either we're going to give them and and I want you all to see even if they answer the wrong way, we're not doing what everyone does. What happens when you ask a question and they tell you the wrong answer that shows they're not a client? Usually you dismiss them. >> You never talk to them again. >> Yeah. >> And it's this ghost. But with And that's so that's everyone always goes lead with value. I'm going to tell everyone leave with value. Leave every conversation by giving value because I'd rather have an advocate that appreciates our conversation and what we did rather than just one client because a client's onetoone opportunity. An advocate can bring me thousands of clients. And so that's why we did that free plus shipping on the backside. they weren't an opportunity, but man, if they read the book and they tell 10 other people about the book, that's opportunity coming to my door. And so that's how we look at it. And so we either go now guys, we either drop in, hey, here's my PDF. Love to be able to offer this. Like right now, I think we're doing um the the three hidden signals on LinkedIn. We're going to if they are an opportunity but not ready yet, we invite them to a webinar that Rachel and I run every month. We always do a different webinar. right now we're in the process of getting ready for um a a new brand launch that we're doing. Um and so now I'm able to bring that into there or I have, you know, the third option which is jump on a phone call. And so like those are the ways that we kind of go through and we we we run everyone to three options not only for ourselves but for our clients and webinars are super powerful too. I don't know if we have time to talk about that but let me tell you that's >> huge huge opportunity on LinkedIn. There's two, LinkedIn webinars and video content, right? Are those those are two? Can you Yeah, talk about those real quick. Uh the opportunities on those two. >> Come on. We can make this podcast five hours, guys. >> Um so I'll drop this. Like so far this year, like last year, Kevin, I did about I'd say I mean like look, I'm a heavy LinkedIn user. I probably did about two and a half million views on my content organically last year on LinkedIn. I'm over 30 million already for the year. And the big difference is LinkedIn's tried video for a while. It it never really clicked until recently. And I mean LinkedIn video has been phenomenal to be able to get massive visibility. And it's not like 30 second clips. I mean my videos that are on there are anywhere from a minute and a half to two minutes. Um and it's not just talk and it's not overproduced, right? Because people are right now if they see overproduced, they're waiting for the pitch. Are you putting this as a post or is there a special place you >> post? It's a post. Yeah, it automatically puts it in the real system like just like everybody else. Um, and you know the big thing I'm doing with my videos, it's not just regular videos like I'm using on the desktop in the right hand corner there's LinkedIn news and it says trending news. And so just like other platforms we have trending hashtags. Well, we live in a 247, I would say, news world, but we all know it's just a 247 media world, especially since the people in charge of the United States right now, most of them came from TV. >> Um, so, you know, it's that's where we're at. So, I use that and I do back in the day, like y'all have been doing this long enough, I I go back to old techniques of what we called newsjing and I will take one of the top trending news articles. I will pair it with my business, my perspective, my audience, and I will create a script or something that I can follow and I will record a video and those videos, I mean, I'm getting millions of views on those videos and millions of and and hundreds if not thousands of interactions. And it's worked really, really well to create massive opportunity for me. And like Kevin, you and I were just at driven and I'm not sure how much I can share. That's if you want to know the real secrets, but like like because they talked about you have to be able to show up in AEO and be able to be the answer. It not only have to be have your content indexed, but it has to be relevant and timely. So when you're doing that, you're talking about news that's trending now and then LinkedIn picks it up because a lot of times you're talking about LinkedIn news team, they run LinkedIn. Let's be honest, they are the most powerful people at LinkedIn right now. they see you're doing a post on that, they'll feature you in the news. Now I'm getting LinkedIn feature me and that's how I'm even showing up more so in AI. Make sense? >> So that's that's that's video. Highly suggest everyone to try it. >> So the video on the post put just a couple a paragraph or description of it and post the video that's or don't or you just post the video with no description. >> No, always have content associated with the video. Yeah, you want to make sure that your post and the video can stand alone. They they work together, but they can also stand alone on their own. So, don't just be like, "Hey, watch my video. I'm going to be going into some secrets here." No, you want your your post to have as juice as as much as you would the video because some people won't watch it. They're only going to read the post. So, it's not not formatted like a Tik Tok video. >> No. >> Hey, Kevin King and Norm Ferrar here. If you've been enjoying this episode of Marketing Misfits, thanks for listening this far. Continue listening. We got some more valuable stuff coming up. Be sure to hit that subscribe button if you're listening to this on your favorite podcast player. Or if you're watching this on YouTube or Spotify, make sure you subscribe to our channel because you don't want to miss a single episode of The Marketing Misfits. Have you subscribed yet, Norm? >> Well, this is an old guy alert. Should I subscribe to my own podcast? >> Yeah, but what if you forget to show up one time? It's just me on here. You're not going to know what I say. >> I'll I'll buy you a beard and you can sit in my chair, too. We'll just You can go back and forth with one another. Yikes. But that being said, don't forget to subscribe, share it. Oh, and if you really like this content, somewhere up there there's a banner. Click on it and you'll go to another episode of The Marketing Misfits. Make sure you don't miss a single episode because you don't want to be like Norm. >> And I mean, I just record. I mean, I'll stop my phone anywhere, right? And I mean, it's real. It's raw. And people see that. I want them to be able to understand. >> What about doing like clips? Like if we took marketing misfits, like uh we do clips right now on Tik Tok and YouTube that are you some good sound bite of you talking for a minute on something. Should we be taking those and putting those on LinkedIn with a little summary like here's >> 100% >> Josh is the expert in LinkedIn blah blah blah he's boom boom boom >> video is working really really well right now guys I mean don't miss out like this is great content you guys have a podcast like you're you're ahead of the curve for most of these people that are out there so 100% and then when you do that if you're going to share a video like that and you're going to tag me in the video make sure you message the person that you're on the podcast with hey we just posted on LinkedIn make sure I engage because if anyone you tag Even if Kevin you post and you tag Norm and he doesn't engage, your visibility goes down because they don't want people um >> well hashtag something or tagging everybody. >> Yeah. >> You know, like, oh, I'm just going to tag Tony Robbins because he has a couple million followers. They don't want that, right? So, they they decrease that visibility. So, anyone that you're going to do that with, make sure they know, hey, I'm posting. Please love please. I'd love to have you engage. >> And what about webinars? Dude, webinars have been gang busters for y'all. Us y'all. I mean, >> we're doing well with webinars on Zoom right now. Um, >> so I was just I was just having this conversation with Jason Fladman um on how to leverage uh LinkedIn um events for webinars because yeah, you're going to run it to Zoom, but what you want to be able to do is so normally Kevin, both of y'all have a couple thousand um connections. So, let's say you build first and foremost, let's let's say you're going to do Marketing Misfits as a webinar. We just did a webinar last week on some AI stuff for Amazon. We had 1,400 people register on a Zoom on a Zoom call. >> Great. >> By just sending emails to them. So, what should how should we take that? >> Do that and do that and create a LinkedIn event for your on your on your company page. >> All right. I want you to do it on your company page, not on your personal page. And I want you to put yourselves as speakers, right? And so the reason why you do that and there's a little button you click to be able to collect their information because when someone registers on LinkedIn's event and you do it on your company page, you can get their first name, last name, and email address that is GDPR certified. It's good, right? Now you're not just getting this. We're not just trading email list with all our friends anymore. We're getting new people that we haven't had registered before. >> Like when we do Yeah. >> And then the webinar is the same. It's linked to that same >> Zoom back off site. Yeah. you're it's just a event page. >> Okay? >> And so what you do is the cool thing is when y'all both are in there and we always do a four to six week leadup to our events. The reason being is each one of y'all have a thousand invites to your connections a week. So if you do a four-week um leadup, that means together y'all get to invite 8,000 of your connections to the event every single month for free. That's huge, right? Being able to go in >> one by one by one, right? So when you do that, it says one by one by one. But what you want to be able to do is if there's little filters like United States, industry, whatever, at least add one of those filters in. And then what it does is it adds it adds finally a select all button. And it'll only show you 50 at a time. But what you want to do is just keep on scrolling and it'll upload more, upload more, upload more. Keep scrolling. >> And you don't want to just, you know, bust out the the thousand all in one thing, right? What you want to be able to do is LinkedIn wants to see that there's growing visibility and and and excitement about your event. So, what we do with our clients, like I said, I'm just telling you all everything. We do 200 a day, right? So, we'll go in and we'll like 200 a day. That means a thou Monday through Friday giving that thousand. So, it's showing growth and then LinkedIn goes, "Wow, this this event's getting popular. People are continually signing up for it. Let's push it out to more audiences." And so when we do it for some of our clients, we'll get anywhere from 400 to a,000 people registered for for that event just on LinkedIn alone. And now I have anywhere from 400 to a,000 new email addresses I didn't have before. So now I can nurture them not only on LinkedIn, but I can actually also nurture them pre and post event via email. >> And so that link that event I'm just trying to make sure I understand that event is still the Zoom event that they're seeing in a LinkedIn window or they're all right. Let me go in here. >> Yeah. Just I'm sure you understand the whole the whole uh step by step. >> Yeah. >> No, no, it's okay. It's okay. I'm going to show y'all my event and you know this now you're now you are going to have to push this out in the next week to make put my podcast in front of everybody because the event's going to be past the time we this thing goes live. But uh hold on. Let me >> All right. So, here's your We'll wait two seconds so it can pop in. >> All right. Can y'all see the page now? >> Yeah. >> All right. So, here's your LinkedIn event page. Here's my event, right? >> Okay. >> I just did this one with a friend of mine, James, but this is the one we got coming up. We just launched this live. >> Um, so when we go in here, I can actually, you know, so we've got it. Here's the Zoom link, right, Kevin? >> Oh, okay. >> Got, you know, here's our >> So, they could just click the Zoom link and go register over there. You're never going to get a double double register >> or to >> now you're trying to get a double optin Kevin. So because when they hit register for the event I can't because it's not my event. I mean it is my event. I can't show you. >> So when they hit register here that's when you're popping up the name and email address. >> Correct. >> Okay. Okay. >> And then if you need to if you have the the registration on Zoom, you want those emails to go out or whatever, just take their first name, last name, and email address and move it over to the Zoom and and do it for them. >> Yeah. No, no, I I understand now. Okay. I got it now. >> So this is that whole piece. But like see like I can go through I can invite and go in here say okay I want to United States show results. See now I'm getting that little bar up here. I've already invited these people but it stops. You just keep on scrolling down. >> Understand? >> Look I invited Kevin Nations. >> Um and we go click here. I got 18. Well if I keep on scrolling >> and I click and I click again now I got 24. Right. So that's how we get to our 200 a day. Um, at the same time I can go in here, manage. I can download registration info. This gives me all the people that register their first name, last name, and email address. I can now pop into my my email. Also, on LinkedIn, you really usually can't message first um, anyone that's not a first-degree connection unless you're doing an inmail. When they register for your event, guess what? You can message second and third degree connections without having to use inmail, which we all know is just, you know, a marketing pitch. So, if I'm hold I'm hosting a webinar this this Thursday uh and two days from now >> like to be able to do it. I would next one >> if I Yeah, it's but if I went and posted this event tonight, would LinkedIn take this and start putting it out? I know it's too late to like >> It will. I mean, yeah, I it's not going to hurt you anything. I mean, put it out there and then you can start you can invite a thousand of your connections. So, what you're going to do is go to events, create an event. You want to change to your business. So, standard authority. We're going to do online event format, external event link. >> This needs to be on my business account, not on my personal account. >> Yeah, business account, >> which will have a lot less followers than my personal. >> Yeah, but it's it's not about that, right? So, external event link, you go here. Always click this use LinkedIn registration form. Okay. >> Right. This gets all their first name. If you don't do that and then you have to drop your your your privacy policy in here. >> Okay. >> And then you put that and then you put your speaker. So then I put in here Kevin King. And neither one of these is you. So I don't even know why it's not even coming up. But I can go here to me and now I'm inviting from my personal profile, not my company profile. >> Oh, okay. >> So that's the thing. You've got 14,000 connections, Kevin. So that's why you make and then I can be like, "Oh, well, you know, I want Norm on here as well, right?" So now Norm's a speaker. He'll get an invite to be able to go in. Now Norm can go in and invite a thousand connections of his connections a week. So the three of us did an event, we'd get 3,000 invites a week to roll up to the event. So that's why when you do these kind of things, even in person events, like I'll tell people like let's say driven, they want to get just because we talked about it, Perry and and Kim and Jason want to be able to get people in. Well, all three of them can do the event and then even put the speakers on there and have them teach them how to be able to do the events. Now you got 10 people on there. You could be inviting 10,000 people a week to a LinkedIn event for free. >> That's interesting. >> The things that people are missing, guys. >> Yeah. No, that's that's good. That's really good. lots of lots of opportunity on there and I mean like it's it's been and like that's just LinkedIn. I I I I think the biggest thing that people aren't paying attention if if anyone takes away what they need to from here. It's not just about LinkedIn. It's about the future of search and where people are going and LinkedIn is the basis of that generative search and like oh is my audience on there probably but who cares? You want to make sure that you're the AEO answer where things are going and LinkedIn will do that for you. The same thing that you know with um same as page Kevin we we talked about like >> on your LinkedIn profile everywhere you've ever been featured every article you've ever been featured in or you've written every podcast you've been on you can start listing those in there and it becomes your same as page and it's got a higher indexing rate thing than your own same as page you would have on your on your on your on your company page it's actually on LinkedIn and now you're getting high higher index into a >> I have a I have a data >> this is why I'm in the top three of LinkedIn experts. >> I have I have a Google a Google doc with 162 podcasts that I've been on as a guest >> with a link straight to them and the transcript. So I need to take that >> and you can add all that in there and what you >> add that or add that where >> on your it's the bottom of the LinkedIn profile. It'll say publications >> and just basically just list them all in there with a link. >> You got to do it one by one. So, I wouldn't tell you to do it, but find find someone that's a little cheaper per hour to to get there and just just load it up or >> just hire me. You know, we'll do it for you, too. >> So, if I want to hire you, if anybody listening wants to hire you, how do they do that? >> I mean, first and foremost, just you know, reach out on LinkedIn and tell me that you love the podcast and uh, you know, tell me why, you know, how they they like you and Norm, right? Like, I love that when someone sends me a message like, "This is why I I I think Norm and Gavin are hilarious and why I listen to them all the time." You know that that's I always dude when I get those matches it's hilarious and like I can be like dude Kevin look at this look what they said about Norm they like Norm better than you you know obviously obviously >> obviously >> but at the same time too I mean y'all they can go to my my website you know standout aority.com you know find out as much information as they want but you know I always love conversation and I mean it's you know this is this is the fun about it I think there's a huge opportunity right now that people are sleeping on and it's one of the few social platforms that you can still make a massive impact without fighting all the other half- naked influencers that are out there um selling things that they have no clue what they do. >> Okay, awesome. Well, top of the hour, a little past the top of the hour, and I always have or we always have a question for our misfit. And if they know a misfit, >> you know, Norm, and this is, you know, probably something I shouldn't do, but I've already I've told you all before, my wife Rachel Bee is, I mean, you guys you guys talk to me, but when you talk to her, I mean, let me tell you, you're going to see where the magic really really lies. I mean, her background, what she does, and how she's left corporate and now doing what she does, like she is the branding lady boss out there, and you really want to understand that world and and see a mind that works differently than how you and I think, highly suggest reaching out to her. >> Fantastic. >> Awesome. >> All right, sir. We're going to remove you right now, but >> appreciate it, Josh. This is uh this is great stuff. >> Yeah, it was fantastic. Thanks, Josh. >> Bye, guys. Thanks, man. >> Okay. I I I don't know what I'm I got some work to do tonight, Norm. Uh I got some work to do. I >> I saw you getting jittery there and almost I'm like ready to go like pull up my LinkedIn right now and like all right, I got to fix this and fix this and fix this and fix that. Um, and yeah, no, I I've always I've seen it as a massive opportunity, but um, it's one of these things, you know, do you it's it's time and and then finding the people to do it for you. Um, >> that that know how to do it or or get guidance from someone like Joshua like this is what you got to do. Go get someone to post all 160 whatever number it is. I have a podcast in that little section for me and I I will do that and and see what happens. Yeah, you and I know from the AEO world, it's something that Dragonfish is doing and that we're working on. I think Josh, we didn't even talk about, he's got something that's pretty cool. Um, that he's working on with a group that might be really good, too, that gives you like this AEO score kind of thing. Um, but, uh, LinkedIn, I think, is going to have to be a component of, uh, what we're doing for some of the people in Dragonfish. >> Yeah, it's it's one of those, uh, sleepers. You you know, it's out there. It's been out there forever and now it's convincing people like today there was a bunch that John and that was the tip of the iceberg the information that he shared >> but it's so powerful and it's like we talk about press releases right >> there's power there and Google business profile and LinkedIn we we got to take care of some of these things and I I hope people listening will take this seriously it's a new world, you all always need to take uh what you hear on the marketing misfits seriously because every Tuesday we put out a serious podcast with serious information just like you heard today. And if you don't share this one with someone, then that means that you didn't learn something today. And I know every single one of you that are listening to this that learned something today. So, be sure to share this podcast, to hit the subscribe button, whether you're listening to this on Spotify or YouTube or or Apple Podcast or wherever you may be watching this because every Tuesday we bring on massively good uh people just like this that are are thinking outside the box and thinking differently. And just imagine what you could learn if you just listen to the Marketing Misfits podcast every single week. How do they do that, Norm? >> Uh they go to marketingmisfits.co co or our YouTube channel which is marketing misfits podcast that's for the long form for the short form 3 minutes and under all the nuggets are extracted from the this podcast that's the marketing misfits clips >> awesome well we'll see everybody again next Tuesday >> all right everybody see you