Build a Business That Can Scale - Networking, Pitfalls, And Clarity | David Gonzalez | MMP #02

Build a Business That Can Scale - Networking, Pitfalls, And Clarity w/ David Gonzalez - Marketing Misfits - Ep. 2 Speaker 1: The most important element in scaling a business is not speed. It's clarity. And all of the individuals that I've seen that become really big and successful, they figure out how to get really clear on what really matters and then that's what they work on. Unknown Speaker: You're watching The Marketing Misfits with Norm Farrar and Kevin King. Kevin King: What's up, Norm? How you doing, man? What's going on? Mike Frekey: Doing awesome. Thank you, Kev. It's actually warming up here in Canada. Kevin King: It's about damn time because I'm tired of listening to you about your nuts freezing when you go outside to smoke a cigar. Mike Frekey: Yeah, and I got to keep taking that knife out of my back every time you talk about Texas weather. Kevin King: Yeah, yeah. Well, see, in Texas right now, I can sit out on my balcony. I was out there with Zoe the other day. I was like, man, Norm would be jealous of me right now, sitting out on my balcony, overlooking the river, overlooking downtown. Zoe there, barking at airplanes and barking at birds flying above. And just imagine if we had a good cigar and a good glass of whiskey for me and a Coke Zero for you, what that would be like. And just the stories that would come out. I mean, you never know what's going to come out, just like you never know what's going to come out on this podcast. Mike Frekey: Right, exactly. I mean, that's one of the reasons why we did this podcast, because so many stories came out on your bloody balcony. Kevin King: It's not just the balcony, it's everywhere. You know, we talk about the origins of this podcast, and the origins of this podcast were us going to Paris for Howard Tai's Big Mastermind. We did this castle outside of Paris, like an hour outside of Paris. We're sitting around one night after dinner, and if you haven't heard the story, I'm going to tell it really, really fast. We're sitting around after dinner one night, there's 10 of us or so around this campfire. We're dropping logs on this campfire, and we're sitting around just telling stories. You know, some of it's about life, some of it's about business, and you and I just look at each other, you know, we're smoking cigars, some people are drinking, and we're like, this is really cool. I'm getting more value out of this than I am of listening to a bunch of presentations. Mike Frekey: Logs of knowledge. Kevin King: Yeah, it was just, it was cool. And you know, our guest today, I've done the same thing with him. When I first met our guest today, this guy is like, he's like a legend in Austin, Texas. Not just Austin, but he's a legend across the world. I don't think there's a more connected person. You know, we know some connected people in our space in Amazon that are pretty well connected. This guy, his Rolodex, He knows everybody and everybody when it comes to business and marketing. He's a master. I remember when I first met him, he does something called the Internet Marketing Party in Austin where every month, it's usually on a Thursday night. I've been to a couple and after one of the parties, I don't remember how it happened. We ended up going and Somehow, I ended up at his house. It was like six of us. Yeah, I think I drugged him. I gave him a piece of chocolate or something. I don't know. But somehow, I ended up at this guy's house. And on the way, he said, hey, meet me at my house. We're going to do a bonfire, roast some marshmallows. I said, all right. So he's like, can you stop and pick up some marshmallows on the way? And I was like, sure, no problem. I'm trying to find this address. It's on one of these streets and it's like numbers 200 to 1,000 are here and then the road stops and there's like two miles of nothing and then the road continues. So I find this little place and I get him and I go into his house and show up and it's in his front yard. His front yard's got this fire going, like this bonfire right in the front yard. I'm like, all right, this is kind of cool. And then around the fires, there's a handful of people and it was the same thing, just sitting there, getting to know each other, talking business, talking life. And that's what this guy is all about. I mean, and I'm really excited to have him on here because I think there's nobody better at marketing And connecting, you know, connecting marketers than this guy. If you don't know David Gonzalez, then you need to know David Gonzalez and you need to go to one of his events because the connections and the changes this guy can make in your life and in your business are huge. This guy, I'm super excited, man, to have him on the show today. Mike Frekey: I just want to know one thing. Maybe it's a Texas thing, but you got two and a half miles, you said, between the road. Was there not another name that they could come up with? Kevin King: I know you think I'd give the road another name on the other side of this, but I was going all over the freaking place trying to figure this out. I'm exaggerating. It wasn't two and a half miles, but it was a break in the road. Mike Frekey: I don't care if it was a hundred yards, but I think there'd be another name. All right, let's bring in David. Speaker 1: Hey, guys. What's up, David? Kevin King: How are you doing, man? Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm doing great. It's just been fun listening in the background because I guess it's like the proverb. It's the digital green room you had me in. I could hear you guys talking. And it's the second Thursday of the month, by the way. Kevin King: It's second Thursday. All right. All right. So I did get it right then, right? I said second week. Speaker 1: You said second Tuesday of the month. Kevin King: Oh, did I? Oh, shoot. Right. Speaker 1: Because you've been eating too many of those chocolates. Kevin King: I think I have been eating too many. Speaker 1: The brain drained out of your top head. Kevin King: No, I did. I did. I did. Norm was staying with me back in December for when you did the Internet Marketing Party here. We did a thing together for Christmas. We did a big Christmas party and you brought in like Hal Elrod to speak like this amazing guy, you know, and it was It was, it was great. Norm was at that event. But Norm was staying with me during that. And he's talking about chocolates, you know, I take care of my guests. And so Norm is into gummies. He loves gummies. Mike Frekey: Regular gummies. Kevin King: Regular gummies, not, not the, not the CBD, you know, whatever, but just regular sugary gummies. It's one of his little treats that he treats himself with. And so he had run out. And so I had some here. That he didn't know I bought him knowing he was coming in. So just to make sure I have some. And so one night I put some under his pillow. I actually took the little bag and put it under his pillow and didn't tell him. So he goes in, Kevin, after we smoke a cigar and have him some drinks or whatever, he goes out and see you in the morning. It's like two in the morning. Goes in there, gets in the bed, sticks his hand under the pillow to organize it. And here's a bag of gummies. Speaker 1: That's awesome. Mike Frekey: The next day he got me dog ice cream. Kevin King: I didn't get it. You ate it. Speaker 1: Well, you had ice cream for your dogs in the freezer and Norm made himself at home. Kevin King: I had those little blue bell cups, those little individual cups that you do at birthday parties. I had those in my freezer. And next to it, I had the little Frosty Paws, which are a dog ice cream. You get, you know, they're actually a little dog, the dog licks it. And right next to it, there are little cups that kind of look it. But the way the cup looks, if it's three o'clock in the morning and you don't have your glasses on, it looks like it's like birthday cake flavor or something. It has the little designs on it. And so Norm actually grabbed one and started eating it. It's like three in the morning because he had a little snack. Gets through about part of it and then goes, this kind of tastes kind of funky, kind of weird. So he looks at it, figures out what it is. And he's like, this is embarrassing. So he goes to the trash can and buries it. He's like, I don't want Kevin to see this on the top. So he buries it underneath everything and doesn't tell me until a couple of days later at dinner and he tells the story. And I could not stop laughing for like 10 minutes. It was just so wicked funny. So that's a running joke we have now. Norm, make sure I have dog ice cream the next time you come for you. Speaker 1: Were you barking? Mike Frekey: Oh, I was howling, that's for sure. Kevin King: He was licking parts of his body he normally doesn't lick. Mike Frekey: Nothing like bologna flavored ice cream. Like it's just... Speaker 1: Bologna flavored. Oh, that's what the flavor was? Mike Frekey: Yeah. Kevin King: It's like a meaty flavor. It's great. It's great. So when was that that we did that little bonfire? Do you remember when that was? That was a while back. Speaker 1: It was at least... Five years ago, minimum. Kevin King: Yeah. Speaker 1: I haven't lived in that house for over five years. It was pre-COVID. I know that. Kevin King: Yeah, it was definitely pre-COVID. It was pre-COVID. I think it was pre-my wife, too. So it might have been my ex-wife. Speaker 1: Because you didn't need to ask for permission to go anywhere. Kevin King: There's another interesting story I have to tell you, Norm, on this. I guess, David, you knew. You met my wife and I filed for divorce. I just became final just recently. I actually got the court order and everything is final. But one of the final straws of this was David was doing an internet marketing party and he called me up like a month before and said, hey, I'm doing this special VIP thing. It's a special party or I forget the exact reason, but I want to have some special people there. You want to come? I was like, yeah, sure. I'd be happy to come. He's like, can I bring my wife? It's like, yeah, no problem. You can bring her too. So we actually, the day of the party, she decides that she doesn't want to go. She doesn't feel good. She has a headache or whatever. She doesn't want to go. So I'm like, all right, I'm just going to go because I told David I'd be there. I want to go. I want to meet some people. So I go. I'm at the event and I get a phone call from her, not a phone call, a text. Where are you? I'm like, what do you mean, where am I? I told you I'm going to the Internet Marketing Party. It's like, yeah, where is it? What's the address? I said, why, do you want to come? She's like, yeah, I'm thinking about coming. Like, oh, that'd be great. Here's the address. So I give her the address. She gets an Uber, shows up like 45 minutes later. You know, I'm watching the door, not going too far to make sure that everything's okay. I never see her come in. And then I'm walking around the floor of this place and all, you know, all of us, David had given out these little bracelets, like these little light up bracelet things for a promotion or one of the sponsors or something. And I'm walking around the floor. And then she finds me. I didn't even see her come in. She's like, comes down these steps, these stairs and like, there you are. And it's like, here, here's your bracelet. I'm like, what? Here's your bracelet. I wasn't even on the list. I'm like, uh, what do you mean you weren't on the list? Uh, you say, I came to the door and I wasn't even on the list. I was like, you were on the list. David put you on the list. It's like, no, he didn't. You didn't want me here. You deliberately, you lied to me, you this and that and the other. Long story short, she goes storming out. We're getting a little tiff in the front of the entranceway there for a little while. She leaves. I said, I'll go home with you. She's like, no, no, you're not. You're not coming anywhere with me. So I go back in like, David, I was just joking with him. I was like, I'm gonna I got another drink. I'm like, David, you got me in trouble. And he's like, I was just kidding with him. He's like, what do you mean? No, what? What? So my wife said she wasn't on the list. He's like, no, she's on the list in like five places. He pulls out his phone shows me she's on the freaking list, like everywhere. And I was like, so here's the mistake I make, though, is I come back home. And, you know, she's sitting out brewing on a balcony. And I was like, she's like, so was it, did you have a good time? I know, I knew you didn't want me to be there. I was like, no, I wanted you to be there. I invited you. I absolutely wanted you to be there. It's like, I wasn't even on the list. I was like, no, you were on the list. I was like, I saw it. David showed me. She's like, so you trust David over me? I said, yeah, I do. A few weeks later, I filed for divorce. That's a true story. Speaker 1: I remember being there for it. I remember you telling me about it. I remember feeling horrible for a split second. I wondered if maybe in the hoopla, because, you know, when you put on events like this, sometimes it's it's easy for little things like that to slip through the cracks, either because I thought I did and didn't actually follow through or I did it, but it didn't make it to the spreadsheet or I did it, but I did it. But by the time I did it, like somebody they preprint, they printed the spreadsheet and the name didn't make it. There's so many things that could have happened. So when you told me she wasn't on the list and I don't know if you remember this, but you playfully said, dude, you're not only get me in trouble, you can get me divorced or something. Kevin King: Decision had already been kind of made. So this is just like the final straw. So I have David, I owe David big time. I have David to thank. Like, David, thank you. You changed my freaking life. The Internet Marketing, I can give you the testimony. The Internet Marketing Party changed my life. It made me execute on a, made me move forward on a decision that I hadn't been making. Speaker 1: Well, I can tell you this, one of my bucket list items was to be an officiant at a wedding. And a couple of years, a few years back, a dear friend of mine asked me if I would officiate his wedding, his wife's wedding. And so I did it. And I did it at this place called the Wizard Academy out near Drippings Springs. Kevin King: Oh, that's a badass place. Speaker 1: Chapel overlooking the Texas Hill Country. And what I decided to do, and this is going to go over some people's head, but if you've ever seen a certain movie that you will know the moment that I say what I'm about to say. So what I did is I had everybody walk in and I had, you know, obviously the groom was up there with all his groomsmen and then the bride walks in, you know, it's the song. And then, like, I just stood there. Quietly for at least, and I'm not exaggerating, 45 seconds and just looked at everybody in complete silence. Then I proceeded to say, marriage is what brings us here together today. And if you've ever seen the movie, The Princess Bride, and both my friend and his bride were fans of that movie, but they didn't know I was going to do that. And it was just like, It was just like a pretty ballsy move because if you don't know what it is, it's like, what the hell? Kevin King: Is this guy been drinking? What the hell is this guy? Speaker 1: And then I brought it back together and stuff, you know, just said, hey, you know, and then I made it like really, really sacred. And I had everybody, you know, make a wish in their mind's eye for one of the most romantic, loving dreams they've ever had for themselves or someone else. And to give that level of energy to the to the couple. And that's what I did. Kind of like when you're at your birthday, you close your eyes and make a wish. I had everybody close their eyes and make a really romantic, deep, loving wish for the couple. I didn't keep it fun, like crazy like that. That would be disrespectful. Kevin King: That place is awesome. I mean, for those of you who don't know, you might have seen this. I mean, this is The Marketing Misfits. The guy that owns that, that started the Wizard Academy is a marketing misfit. He's one of the sharpest guys when it comes to direct marketing or especially he specializes in radio. But he wrote the Wizards of Ads books. You can look them up on Amazon or whatever it is, a series of three. And he went out, this is something you should do, David, with your connections. He went out and he actually interviewed all these successful entrepreneurs and wrote like two pages or three pages on each one of them with like a marketing Tidbit or it was like a couple of paragraphs or like their story. Who is this person? And it was like, this is how they got to what they did. And this is the marketing strategy. Put these together in a book called The Wizard of Ads and had a series of three of them. And it's freaking amazing. And then I remember going out. He started doing these little little write ups. Yeah, he had he had the Friday email or Monday morning email, whatever was called. It's like this badass email that would come out before there was really newsletter emails or anything that would have a tip of the week. And then on Fridays, he would do these things out. He had, at first, it was out in Buda, a little suburb south of Texas, south of Austin. And he would actually have, you could pay a couple grand or something like that. And he'd have little marketing meetups or ads where he'd bring people in. But it grew so much. That he went out and he bought this property out by the Salt Lake, a famous place out in Austin, not too far from that barbecue place. And he, up on this top of this hill, that's what Dave was talking about. And he built this whole like Academy, like with dorm rooms and like a chapel. And it's got a, like a crazy-ass scotch and whiskey room that's just like, got like, I don't know, 5,000 different bottles or something in it, some crazy number like that. And this chapel is free to use. So he's like, anybody wants to book a wedding here, it's free, you don't have to pay. So it's a stunning place. And this guy, The Wizard of Ads. Yeah, it's a really, really cool hit. Do you ever speak at one of your... It's Roy Williams, right? Speaker 1: Yeah. Unknown Speaker: He spoke at one of your events, right? Speaker 1: That video is in the members area, internetmarketingparty.com forward slash join. Kevin King: There you go. Speaker 1: I wouldn't be much of a marketing misfit if I didn't plug my thing, right? Kevin King: That's right. So, the Internet Marketing Party, let's talk about that. I mean, Norm, you went to the one that we did with Hal, with the Christmas one. Have you ever been to any other of David's Internet Marketing Parties, like a Traffic and Conversion or some of the other ones he's done around that maybe are not in Austin? Mike Frekey: No, I haven't. I've heard great things, but that was the first time I actually briefly got to meet David. And I couldn't stop laughing in that costume, by the way. Kevin King: That was great. A little Santa Claus. Mike Frekey: Yeah. Kevin King: Where did the concept come from for this? I mean, you own an agency, you've been doing this for a while or tell us the backstory. Speaker 1: No. Yeah. It was real simple. I sold a business. I had a million dollar a year hypnotherapy business that I So, I had money and time and I was going into real estate and that was right before the 2008 crash. So, I had a friend that ran, named Michael Lovitch, who ran a company called the Hypnosis Network and he was making millions of dollars selling hypnosis CDs on the internet. This was way early on. It was pre-Facebook, pre-YouTube. It was, you know, back 2006, 2007. And I called him up and I said, hey, man, I want to know more about this stuff because I read Tim Ferriss' four-hour work week. And I was like, this sounds a lot like what you're doing. And he said, yeah, come on up. Some friends of mine named Kevin Wilkie and Matt Gill, the founders of Nitro Marketing, were up here in Dallas in the Fort Worth area. And once a month, we get together and we do this meetup and you should come up. And I was like, OK. So I came up there and I found out there's all these guys in Austin doing Digital marketing, this guy named Ryan Dice and Perry Belcher and Mike Dillard and Steve Gray and Jordan Hall and Mike. It was just this big group of folks. And so we would all get together, get in the car and drive up to Dallas once a month. And one month on the way home, we were like, You know, what the hell are we doing driving all the way to Dallas? We should do these in Austin. And somebody said, yeah, David, you definitely should. And I guess, okay, sure, I'd be down. And then the next month, a guy named Eric Louvier posted in Warrior Forum, which is an old marketing forum. David Gonzalez is hosting the first, we used to call it the Austin Internet Marketing Entrepreneur Network, which the acronym is AMIN. I just decided to do the first one. I did it at this bar called Six Lounge, which Lance Armstrong used to be one of the co-owners to. It was right at the corner of Fourth and La Vaca. We're fourth in Colorado, fourth in Lavaca. And we have the first one was a lot of fun. So we did it again the next month. And that was a lot of fun. And about four months in, Michael had the idea that we should have a speaker. And the objective was to create a big email list. Because this was back in the day when there was this guy named Jeff Walker, Frank Kern, Andy, Andy Jenkins, and Mike Vilsaim. They were all part of this thing called the syndicate. But they would all promote each other's big product launches, like the StomperNet launch and the product launch formula launch and the mass control launch. And they'd make $100,000 a month. They'd basically make $1 per subscriber per email. If you had 100,000 subscribers, you could make just stupid money every time there was one of these launches. And so Michael was like, dude, we should start bringing in a speaker. And then record the speaker and then like have that be content that we can get people all around the world to subscribe and become members. And I was like, that sounds cool. And we did it another month and another month and a month became a year and a year became five years and five years became 10. And we just celebrated our 15th in September of this past year. And it just keeps being fun. Kevin King: You haven't missed one, right? I mean, I think not a single one, even during COVID, you switched to virtual for some of them, right? Speaker 1: Yeah, that's correct. Kevin King: You've never missed one? Speaker 1: No, I mean, I've actually even had it to where there was one or two months where I didn't run the party. I just had somebody else run it. But the show went on. Kevin King: And then you did them, I don't know if you're still doing it, but you were doing them like a traffic conversion. And I think you did one at Funnel Hack, was it Funnel Hacking Live? Or it was something in Orlando? Speaker 1: Funnel Hacking Live, Capitalism Conference, Paleo FX. Basically, sometimes people will say to me, hey, I've got this conference I'm doing, this seminar I'm doing, this workshop I'm doing. And if they have enough traction, they're like, you know, people like starts on Saturday, so people are flying in on Friday. It ends up being a win-win because we do us doing the party. We already have the brand of people know like, oh, there's going to be an IAM party. And so when we promote that, they're like, oh, what's going on? And then they find out about the other thing, you know, and so we end up saving them from having to do a kickoff party. Like, you know what I mean? Kevin King: Yeah, yeah. And you get to benefit. Like you're saying, some people that are coming to that, they learn about you and some people that don't even know about that event, they learn about that event because you're hosting a party like, oh, I might as well stay for the other thing too. Speaker 1: Yep. Kevin King: Yeah. Speaker 1: So it ends up being a big win win. And yeah, I've had every had just a bunch of great, great folks on our stage. And it's these are little players. Kevin King: I mean, just for you all. Listen, if you've never been, these aren't like, OK, little little Internet marketers. These are the like the who's who. I mean, you just said Dave Asbury just recently, you know, Dave Asbury. Speaker 1: No, no. Kevin King: I mean, we're in this thing. I'm holding a drink in one hand and listening to Dave talk. And then he says this this this quote. That's about, you know, once you reach a certain level in business, you have to start taking care of, I'm paraphrasing here, you have to start taking care of yourself more than you taking care of the business or something along those lines. Speaker 1: Yeah, he said when you're a leader in a business that reaches a certain level, your new job becomes personal development. Kevin King: Yeah. And I was like, that's really good. So I'm whipping out my phone, typing this note so I can like quote him in my newsletter or whatever. But so, I mean, that's the level of people that you're bringing. How long did it take for you to actually get to that to where this type of people were like, yeah, I'm coming because I'm assuming most of them, you're probably not having to pay or anything. You might have to be. Speaker 1: No, I've never. I've never paid a speaker ever to speak. And even though many of them charge a speaking gig, a speaking fee, and they fly here on their own dime. Kevin King: Oh, they do? Okay. Speaker 1: And they put themselves up in the hotel on their own time. And it's just something that because when we first started, it was absolutely bootstrapped. It was just a hobby fun thing. It was just we would get shit faced all afternoon. Get them on stage like where they could barely talk. It was based on originally on the idea that like, you know, when you go to a conference or a seminar or workshop or any industry event, you know, there's the people on stage. And then we always thought it was funny that like, The main place where you do deals is at the bar, right? Like you're like wheeling and dealing, like making deals, joint ventures and strategic alliances. And we'd find that sometimes it's like, oh, we'd stumble into the conference room and we'd hear the speaker and they were just like a stick on a law, you know, bump, you know, just like a stick up their butt. And then they'd get off stage and they were like a completely, they'd take off the mask and they'd be a normal human being again. Like on stage, they were just like this, just saccharine like. It's a crappy version of a human, you know, that's like, hi there, I'm here, like, you know, like sales pitchy kind of thing. And then they'd come to the bar and be cool, like, just like a regular human. And we're like, what happened to the guy like on the stage? Like, you're way cooler. Like, so we decided it would be cool to have a speaker in the bar and get them shit faced. And like, they don't have permission to sell anything from stage because it's not really cool to be getting people drunk and having them It's just a weird thing. It was always just about having it be a place where there isn't a, like, oh, we're VIPs, so we're over here, you're over there. It's just kind of like a watering hole where everybody's all the same and yes, this guy might make $80 million a year and this guy might make $80,000 a year. But at the end of the day, the guy making $80,000 might be the perfect video editor that makes the person making $80 million a year. They're making $80 million a year, but they've got eight followers on YouTube and they can help each other out. How much money you make, the guy making $80,000 a year might be the best person ever for the guy making $80 million to become To scratch their itch of getting notoriety because a lot of times I'll know people who have become very wealthy, but they actually envy the guy that's making like 8, you know, 8 million a year because the guy making 8 million a year has like 80 million fans on YouTube, you know, and they're making 80 million a year, but they don't have any fans on YouTube. Mike Frekey: Yeah, it's kind of like the athletes. Athlete wants to be an entertainer, singer, the singer wants to be the athlete. You know, it happens all the time. You know, it sounds like, sorry, David. Speaker 1: No, you're good. Mike Frekey: It sounds like an organization that's out there, used to be called YEO. Speaker 1: Yeah, it's still around. Mike Frekey: Yeah, yeah, they've changed the names. I think it's EO now. It used to be awesome. They bring in people from, you had to have a certain amount of sales, but the events, man, you could just sit there, have a drink, talk, guard down, and you could learn a lot more just having that one drink. And they brought in speakers too. But it was like at a peer level. So it was really kind of cool. And to build a network, It was awesome. You got to meet so many people. Speaker 1: Yeah, in fact, I'm an EO alum. Me too. But yeah, cool. Yeah, that's how, you know, I've always enjoyed, you know, interacting with really intelligent people that have creative ideas and make the rubber hit the road. Kevin King: So you started off with With getting them drunk, and these guys speak for like 15 to 20 minutes typically, right? It's about a 15, 20 minutes. Speaker 1: It depends. If they're really good, it'll go 30 to 40. And I say really good just because sometimes, even if the content is really good, sometimes they just suck at delivering it. And sometimes their delivery is really good, but they're just not really like, you know, it's like, hey, we're here to do, you could be standing next to somebody that could make you another two or $3 million next year, you know? Kevin King: What's some of the, what's a story that you've heard? Like you're telling this 80,000 to 80 million guy or what you just said. Have you, are there any anecdotes that you can tell us about someone that came to this, that just, that's a really cool story about how it really, they made a connection there that just really transformed their life or their business? Speaker 1: I would say there's a bunch of them, but one of them is a guy named Adrian Brambilla, who's one of our guest speakers. And we did a think tank for him. And he had his first million dollar day a few months later as a result of having that done. I've had people meet there and get married. I've had people meet there and get divorced. I've had people meet there. There's a guy on the website, if you go to imparty.com, on the website, he literally says that we should change the name to the $25 million party because he made a connection there that yielded him $25 million within the next 24, 48 months. It was 12 to 24 months. It was a year or two later. Kevin King: You just mentioned Think Tank. You kind of evolved it from getting them drunk and then putting them up on stage to where you started doing, I don't remember what point it was, but you started doing where the speaker would come in. So they're speaking the parties at night, say at 630. That day you get together at like 11 and you'd ask the speaker, like, hey, what are your pain points in your business right now? And they say, oh, I'm having this or something like that. Speaker 1: I do that in advance. I do that like a month in advance. Kevin King: That's what I mean. You ask them in advance before they come. It's not like the day of. And he figures out what their pain points. And then David, through his network, would curate a list of people, some local, some that are coming in, and say, all right, you're giving us value because you're coming and speaking to my audience, so let me give you some value back. And there'd be 10, 15 people or something maybe in a room around a big conference table. And they would just tear this, this person would tell them, this is my pain points. David has a whole process for it that's really, really good. And they would help him and he invited me to a couple of those to sit on the panel to give some advice and it was freaking awesome. And now you did that for a while and now you've taken it even to another level where you're doing these think tanks quarterly and they're freaking amazing what you're doing. Speaker 1: Thank you. Yeah, that was just, that was actually a happy accident because I've got a business coach that gave me, he said, you know, for our 15th anniversary, he said, you're going to have four to 500 of the biggest names in the industry there. I think you should make a list of the 20 of them that you think have a high degree of probability of saying yes to spending five to 10 grand with you for a weekend. And I was like, okay. And I made a list of 20 people. And the first six people I talked to said, sure, I'm in. You were one of those, Kevin. You know, you know, it's funny, because I literally I was like, oh, this person, this person would be I think, that I have enough rapport and response potential with them that they'd be like, yeah, like, I trust that you would bring together 10 people that would be worth spending a weekend with. Second, people that I knew could have, you know, five to ten grand wasn't going to break the bank for them. And then third was somebody that I just felt like if they said no, it wasn't going to break my heart or anything. That was basically it. And so I did that and because he was trying to help me figure out a new business model. And he said, how cool would it be if like once a quarter you just put on cool events with great people in very exotic, you know, luxurious locations? And you made like an extra three to six hundred thousand dollars a year from just doing that like on top of your regular business. And I'm like, That would be great. And he said, let's just start with a simple, you know, alpha model. Like, let's just do a beta test. And just the worst thing that happens, he said, just tell everybody you talk to and just say, hey, no harm, no foul. If you're not interested, I'll never bring it up to you again. And the first six people I talked to said yes. And I was like, coach, they all said yes. What are we doing with them? And he was like, what are we doing with them? And I was like, what do you mean? And this guy had a $600 million exit. So I was thinking he would be my like, my my Huckleberry, you know, he'd be the he'd be like the the expert, like kind of holding court. And he hosts masterminds as well. And he's like, bro, you're coaching for you isn't filling the mastermind. You're coaching for you is this is time for you to host your own event. You always put people on stage and you do the thing and it's time for you to be the guy. And I'm like, Wow. Okay. So, that's when I decided, oh, this thing that I do for the guest speakers, they always rave about it. I mean, these aren't irregular hot seats. These are basically, it's normal for the person in the hot seat to cry because it's a three-hour hot seat where the person, the experts sitting around the table are not allowed to give any suggestions, solutions or ideas for the first hour. All you can do is ask clarification questions. So when you have, you know, I call it the expert forge of, you know, five to 10 people who are world class at the thing that you're trying to Unlock and figure out. And they're just drilling into you and drilling in and drilling in. It's, you know, they're asking hard questions like, what have you tried? What haven't you tried? How many people on your team? What's your org chart look like? What were your revenues last year? What was your profit margins? What were the revenues a year before? How much of what you tried that didn't work? Were you responsible for it not working? You know, stuff like that, like where it just gets really intense, really deep. Kevin King: I went to the first one that you did. I paid, actually. I paid. David called me and he said, this is what I think about doing this. What's the price? He's like five grand. Yeah, I'll be five. I'll do it. I don't know if I really want to be on the hot seat. So let me think of that. You know, I have a few issues, but I don't know. But I can just get value just by being there, just by showing up and like, Can I be a fly on the wall? And David's like, well, I don't know. We're not really doing that. So you had to get that some thoughts. And so he ended up putting me on a panel, a couple of panels, and that's where I met a couple of the other guests that have actually either have been on The Marketing Misfits or will be on The Marketing Misfits, Katie and Kat, and super smart people. And I remember one of the guys was there and he was, like you said, the grilling, he was like, yeah, we're getting, I forget his exact numbers, I'm making this up, but we're getting like 30 leads a week and we're closing two of them or something like that, you know, we just can't grow. So they didn't just let that go. They're like, OK, who's answering the phone? Oh, it's this guy. Well, who are you passing to? What is he saying? What are his exact words? Well, oh, you need to change. No, you're saying these five words. You've got to put these two words need to go out of your vocabulary. You need to change it to these three words and watch your conversions go. It's that specific. And then there's another guy that I end up with my podcast studio that was there. Afterward, he set up a podcast studio business and he had some growing pains. The group went through everything. And at the end of it, he just had to sit there because it's so intense. You know, it's like he said, sit there and collect himself. And like, you know, you could see a little tear come out some of the people's eye. It was it was that good. And I'm like, this is this is good, David. This is you're making a difference in people's lives. And it's really, really cool. And then you went way and above. You talk about marketing and, you know, you're marketing misfits. You weren't just satisfied. OK, people came and paid me five grand. A lot of these people, you curated a group of people around the speaker. You got their pain point and said, okay, let me find people and you like busted down walls. You called Norm on the second one like, hey, I need someone that knows Amazon or off Amazon, like going from Amazon to Shopify. I need something like you were like turning over every stone. It's not like, okay, I got some people in my Rolodex. If they're not in my Rolodex, you're like hunting them down. You're like posting on social media, like following one person's lead to another person's lead to another person's lead until you find the right people and you put them in that room. And I remember the guy that had the Shopify thing. I was in on his deal and he came in with a set objective and he's like a set problem. When he left, he completely changed everything. His whole mind says like, what I came in here to get help on, I'm not even going to do anymore. Everybody in this room talked me out of it. And he's like, this has been the best thing ever. But then David, from a marketing point of view, On the people that come in, some of them are local, some of them fly in on their own dime or they come in to help out. But he took care of them. It's not just like, okay, show up. Thank you very much. Like you see a lot of conferences. Appreciate you coming out. Enjoy some free water and grab some chips. It was, he took care of them. He's like, he had, David went out, this impressed me. He went out for every person. I don't know if it's every person, but I saw you do it for several people. And he actually thought about this and actually got custom gifts for every single person that was there. That especially, I got one, I saw a couple other people get them. I don't know if every single person got it, but The people that he wanted to make sure that he actually went out and he's like, thought about them, wasn't like, okay, let me make this, you know, go buy a bunch of fancy chocolates and give everybody a box of chocolates for coming. Um, it was like, all right, what is, what is something that's very unique for Kevin? And let me go get a, get a, get a present. He got me, I have it sitting here by my cigar thing, Norm, in the house. I have a little box of the little, uh, the K, uh, you know, on the, on the glass. And then he did the same thing for other people. And it's like, here, I just appreciate your time. I just want to give you some, But just doing that, most people don't, when it comes to marketing, that's what a miss, you could call that a misfit. But that's actually, that's a smart fit. When you actually do that, because those little things, you'd be surprised in marketing how much those little things go over and above. On my first BDSS that I did in Austin 2019 at the Driscoll, you were there, Norm. We were smoking cigars on the balcony with everybody, which is now a tradition. We're doing it in Hawaii on the beach as a formal event. But to get people to, everybody that bought a ticket, because this was a $6,000, I think it was $6,500 ticket. I actually sent them a care package from Austin. Mark went out and sourced this and we got like barbecue sauce and like all this awesome stuff. Put it in this special box. It cost me about $150 a person plus another 50 bucks to ship this shit. So like $200 a person to send this out. But I sent that out as a care package like, hey, welcome to Austin. You're going to have a good time in Austin. I want to get you prepped for Austin. And they loved it. And what did they do? Because this is my first event. So people were like 6,500 bucks to actually come to this event. I know Kevin, I know he's pretty smart. I know it'd probably be okay. But man, this is a lot of freaking money, plus my airfare, plus my hotel. I send that to them. They're like, holy cow, this is freaking amazing. Then what they do, they take pictures of it and they show it on social media. Look what Kevin just sent me. Everybody else is seeing that. What is that? Oh, it's for a billion dollar sales summit. You should go. I'm going, you should come, you should come. How many tickets did I sell off the back of that? Just for doing that little gesture. That's something that I think our society has lost and something that David is very good at, not just at his think tank where he did that, but I've seen him do it other places too. He takes care of people and he shows appreciation. He makes sure to come up and shake your hand, make sure you come up and give you time and acknowledge you. And that's something that a lot of people just don't do. How much have you seen that really happen at any events or stuff that you go to, Norm? Mike Frekey: Yeah, that's sort of the personal side. You know, the personal relationships have gone away. And I'm not sure why. Maybe it's just because of the digital thing with Zoom now. But if you're the person and you're going through, and I learned this through YEO, going up to people, introducing yourself, making a little bit of small talk, but just getting people, well, one of the reasons I grew this bloody beard is so people would remember me. And I'd go up and I'd shake their hand and I'd talk to them. I'd always take their name twice so I could remember their name. It's just not a name. But I want to talk about something that's incredible. And this is from what I heard from Kevin. I've never been to your think tank, but the moderator. Being able to moderate and do it effectively. That's a skill set that very few people can do. Just going through YEO forms. If you were doing a form which was once a month, but we do these retreats, you'd bring in a moderator because none of us could moderate properly. And I hear you're incredible at that. Where did you get those skills? Speaker 1: Well, thank you for the kind words. And let's see, where did I get this skill? I think it has to do with, it is a combination of things. I don't know that it's a skill. I think what it is, is when I started doing these for the guest speaker at I Am Party, it always felt like such an absolute privilege. To be able to be in that seat, because candidly to be a little vulnerable, there were often times when even though I had sold a business, when I came into this industry of digital marketers, there were a lot of these folks that were making tens of millions of dollars. Like hand over fist, just printing money. And they were doing it back when like when AdWords first started and when Facebook first started and when you know, email marketing was it was like, just you could just print money. If you know what you're doing, you still can. There were so many different things that at the inception of it, it was just people were mopping up the floor in business. And I had this feeling of like, wow, all these people are people that everyone else would stand in line to get a picture with them or paying tens of thousands of dollars to be in their mastermind or whatnot. And here I was in a seat where I was sitting next to them with a room full of people that were experts at solving their biggest problem. That was gonna lead to an extra six or seven figure win. And I had the privilege to moderate that. And so it's easy for me to be a really good listener when there's really intelligent people in the room. Like it's almost like my brain latches on really nicely. You know how sometimes it's like hard to pay attention to certain things. And then other times you're just like, it's like a heat seeking missile. You can't not be on to the thing. And that's what it feels like for me is just this privilege of getting to be the one that all of a sudden you've got people like Noah Kagan and Roland Frazier and Craig Clemens and Jay Abraham. Like legends in the in the world of business and marketing that are now kind of competing for who's going to ask the best question and who's going to give the best solution. And it's like sometimes people will start to give solutions and ideas during the question part. And it's just so Easy and empowering and fun to be able to tell this person that normally no one ever tells them no, like, hey, hey, hey, we're not there yet. And to know that I've done that enough times that what ends up happening is fast forward an hour down the road and it'll be really clear that the solution that they were so eager to give, that they had to give because they knew it was a thing. Is it the right solution for this particular person in that particular situation? Because three minutes later, someone would ask some clarification question that would invalidate the thing they were so excited about talking about. And so it's almost kind of fun to just be the one that's Holding that space and getting to shut down people that are not used to getting shut down and not from an ego place But like no now is not the right time. It's like giggling at a funeral. It's not the right time, you know So there's time to giggle and then maybe that's afterwards when you're having great memories over drinks and stuff about the person that's Not with the senior, but that's not the right time to be doing it while the eulogy is being read. So it's the same kind of thing. You know, it's like there's a time and a place and I just find it, I think it's almost a bit of a, you know, nature nurture. I think some of it is nature. I think it's part of my natural way of being, is I love being really present with things that matter and people that matter. And I love to be able, I kind of feel like I've always been the, The JV guy and the affiliate guy and the connector guy and the broker guy. And when I get in that seat of being the facilitators, what I call it, I just feel like something turns on in me in the same way that when you watch those videos. 98-year-old, 100-year-old person scrunched over, their fingers can hardly move and you put them in front of a piano and there used to be a concert pianist and all of a sudden they just, their whole body transforms and their fingers move like puppets and they just like come fully alive. I feel like that's what happens to me when I'm in that facilitator seat. I'm just paying attention to all the different experts and who's checked out and who hasn't said anything the entire time. And almost always, they've got something that if I call on them, because there's always going to be people that are really loud and boisterous. And they're like, they always want to take control of the room. You probably can think of a couple of people like that right now in the seller industry, that they're always the loudest person. They're always center of attention. But sometimes there's somebody that's super quiet, super introverted, that they're gonna say something that's a hundred times smarter than the loudest, most boisterous, most... popular person. And so I like finding those moments and it just it. Yeah, I hope I've answered your question. Mike Frekey: Oh, yeah, yeah, you have. And I guess the other thing, because of your connections, these huge connections that you have, marketing must be fairly simple. The hard part is, well, for you, it's just getting those connections. That's part of your overall marketing. So when you're doing these think tanks, what do you have to do other than word of mouth? Speaker 1: Well, a couple of things I want to say. The first one I did was 5k. They're now 15,000. And part of that is because I had some of the experts actually get mad at me, like literally, like really low. Kevin King: It was too low. It was really good. I was like, that's why six people said yes right away. Five grand. Oh, yeah, this is like pennies on the ground for the value you get from this. Speaker 1: And then the getting the experts, I find that to be You know how there's certain challenges that are... Kevin King: You like that hunt. Speaker 1: They're almost overwhelming. They're almost like... How am I going to pull this off? Like, but at the same time, it's like, I know I can pull this off. You know what I mean? It's I've heard it said that, you know, Mick Jagger and that he still gets butterflies before he goes on stage after all these years, you know. And so it's not that it doesn't get me nervous that I'm going to be able to put the right One of my favorite things to do is to have the person that's the navigator, the other one getting the hot seat, sit in that chair because they don't ever know exactly who the experts are. And then what we do is for the first 10 minutes is I go and I give everybody 30 seconds to a minute to share what earned them the right to be an expert at that think tank. And when they go around that room and let's say it's a person that's, you know, they're like, hey, I'm trying to figure out how to do paid traffic because my business is affiliate driven. And they'll be like, hi, my name is Nick Coats and I run Sawtooth Media. We've probably done about $800 million in paid traffic over the last six years. I used to be head of business development at ClickBank and, you know, like yada, yada. And then they're like, Whoa, how'd you get them here? And then the next person is like, oh, hi, my name is Jason Kutasi. I sold my business for $300 million. And it was all affiliate driven. But we then we moved to paid traffic. And that's when we really took off. And, you know, it's like, and everybody that's in the expert seat thinks they're a big deal, because they have a $30 million company until the next guy is like, no, our company does $300 million a quarter. And they're like, whoa, so there's almost this kind of like, really beautiful dance. Then the next thing you know, the guy who's the biggest room and biggest person in the room will end up realizing like, he doesn't know some of the things that some of the people that are way smaller than him know, and they end up partnering together. So there's like this value vortex that gets created amongst the experts themselves. Sometimes the experts will end up getting more value than the person in the hot seat because the person The experts already have so much momentum that if you're going 500 miles an hour, a one degree shift in angle, you'll end up in New York City instead of Chicago. You know what I mean? So with that in mind, a lot of times the experts will have, they get as much value if not more than the person sitting in the hot seat when they came to give. And that's one of the most beautiful things about it. And so because I know that, it makes it easy. It's almost like, I don't care whether you're a Burning Man person or not, you've already seen enough pictures of it that if there's the perfect person to go to Burning Man and they've never been, It's my job to get them to go because I know how much they're going to thank me for it later. You know what I mean? So it just becomes kind of a fun challenge of knowing that they come into this thing thinking that it's another mastermind, or thinking that I'm asking them to give free consulting, or thinking that I'm crazy for asking them to fly to Austin on their own dime and come and help me in my business when I'm getting paid to help the person that I'm getting paid from and for. But to shatter all those misconceptions so that by the end of it, they're like, you know, I can't believe I'm saying yes to you, but yeah, I think I'm in. And then what will end up happening is they'll call somebody like Alex Sharfman or Kevin or Ron Lynch or Tom Shipley, and they'll go, hey, this guy Dave Gonzalez just called me and asked me if I'd fly to Austin in a month. Like, I live in Tampa or Tucson or Toronto and like, or even Costa Rica or whatever. And they're like, is this guy legit? Unknown Speaker: Columbia. Speaker 1: And one dude's like, yeah, Columbia. And they'll be like, is this guy legit? And they'll be like, you need to get there. Like you, in fact, you need to get there before he fills the expert seats, because there's only 10 to 12 of those seats. And if you once he fills them, like he'll just says, yeah, we don't need you after all. Kevin King: I've been to the two that you've done and I highly recommend anybody listening out there, either if you want to be a navigator and have your business analyzed by some of the smartest people in the world when it comes to marketing and entrepreneurship, or if you are someone that knows quite a bit, how would people on that, before we how would people actually, is it, what website do they go to to actually get information on that? Speaker 1: Oh, 3daythinktank.com and we, I actually now have it to where I sell 10 experience passes where if somebody, because after we did the one you did, Kevin, I had Brian Kazubuki and Greg Jeffries came up to me and they're like, hey man, I got so much value from being able to sit as a fly on the wall that even if I hadn't gotten the think tank, this would have been worth 10 or 15 grand. And I was like, really? And they're like, yeah, you left, you left money on the table by not offering people the chance to just come and maybe not stay in the mansion because there's only 10 bedrooms. And but like, you know, there's there's Airbnbs that are within a five minute walking distance. It's out in the it's out in like the hill country right next to the lake, Lakeway. And so I was like, yeah, let's start doing that. So now I've got experience passes that I'm selling as well for that for those and I do them. Typically, it's the first weekend of the first month of the quarter. So one in I mean, the third month, the quarter, so one in March, one in June, one in September and one in December, first weekend, first full weekend. Kevin King: And one of the things you did cool with this, the second one that you did is you actually brought in you did a charity component, which I thought was really, really cool. So there's a local You put out the word on Facebook. I don't know. It's kind of almost last minute. You had the idea like, hey, I want to actually give back, not just that people are paying a lot of money, but Do something good for a cause. So there was a local charity in Austin that you invited their team, their executive team to come in. So it wasn't like one person in the hot seat. It was like, I think it was three of them, their marketing girl, one of the co-founders and the president or something like that. And then you asked some of the experts like, Hey, do you mind just hanging around? We're going to do a modified version, not quite as long. But helped them out in their pain points of raising money for their charity and stuff. That was really freaking cool too. Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to acknowledge you, by the way, for A, bringing that up and B, for sticking around because it was a little bit, Yeah, in anything you do, there's nothing that's just all gold. Sometimes there's shadow and sometimes there's dark meaning like, damn it, that didn't quite go the way I wanted. But when I, you know, we had just finished a think tank, and it was kind of, yeah, it was like, hey, there's a bonus piece to this is I had this, this nonprofit called Austin Safe Alliance. And they, they're a shelter, and they're a harbor, and they're a resource for people that have been sex trafficked, or that have been abused, or that have been battered, or who've been And they've been put in situations that are really, really like either life-threatening or just extraordinarily traumatic. And they, you know, They won the competition to get a think tank, but I didn't have enough time to source the experts that they needed. So what I decided to do is, hey, everybody that's here, if you'd like, I'd like to have you be part of a strategy session so that we together can come up with what's the best experts we need and what are the experts that in our, and so it's not just me sourcing the experts, we could, you know, we'd have a bigger, better net to cast from. And it was a little bit disconcerting that I said that to the entire crew and maybe four or five people stuck around and you were one of them, Kevin. So I want to acknowledge you for that. Not only did you stick around, but you were really paid a lot of attention. You were really engaged and you really brought a lot of value to that conversation. It was really, really a nice thing to see. Kevin King: Appreciate that you had someone else there that just like they would say something I know a guy for that I know a guy that goes to the left of me forget. He like was super connected on a lot of the issues that could solve a lot of their pain points too. Do you remember who that was? Speaker 1: Geez, you got to remember, I did almost 10 think tanks that weekend, not including that thing. So, like, I don't want, I feel a little embarrassed that I don't remember, but it's kind of like when you're just like, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, back to back, hosting and, you know, coordinating and. Kevin King: So they say in business that, you know, if you want to learn networking and being around people, you never want to be the smartest person in the room, like you just said. But sometimes the smartest person in the room, like you just said, could actually learn from the people that were doing less, you know, like you just said. But you always want to be in rooms where you're like, you think you're the big cow and then everybody else around you is bigger because that's where you're going to learn. But a lot of people, they go when they want to learn, they use like self-help books or they use like strategy books or something like that. But a lot of people say that's not the best way to actually learn. Read biographies of successful people. Read Elon Musk's biography or read, you know, whoever it is that you admire or it's been good in business, read their biography. You basically, by doing these think tanks and by doing all these internet marketing parties, you've been reading lots of biographies face to face. So what would you say for the people listening, just to kind of wrap this up a little bit, are some key things that you see that are common among these very successful people that you admire, that you think that other people need to like, hey, you know, pay attention to this and this and this. Characteristics of, I'm not saying like, you know, this is their marketing plan or whatever, but what are some things that you see That really set apart the big time players and winners from the just everyday guys are just doing okay. Speaker 1: The big time, the winners, and it depends on what area of life you're talking about. If you're talking about the area of business, they almost always have team figured out. They learn how to lead, they learn how to build teams, and they also tend to be really good at modularizing their skill sets, which is like, they learn a basic fundamental foundational piece and they get really good at, and then they build another piece on top of it and another piece on top of it, but they know all the pieces well, so that they're not relying on others. But as a result of having those fundamental foundational modular pieces, they can then hire and build teams and know when their teams are doing well or not. Another one and probably the most significant one that's come as a result of me hosting all these think tanks, because I've done pretty much one a month for over 13 years before I started doing them like this. And that was the most important element in scaling a business is not speed. It's clarity. And all of the individuals that I've seen that become really big and successful, they figure out how to get really clear on what really matters. And then that's what they work on. So right now, if there's any part of your business that isn't working as well, As you want it to, that's only because there's something you're not clear about. There's a gap that you're not clear about. There's a solution you're not clear about. There's a skill set you're not clear about. And you're either pretending not to know or you don't know. And once you get clear on what that is, you now have a choice as to whether you figure out how to fix it yourself, like inside of yourself as a skill set, or as a, you know, or you hire it out. But if you don't know what it is, you can't fix it. And if you're not willing to look at it, because there's some things I think sometimes people Even sometimes there's that idea that our biggest fear isn't fear of failure, but it's fear of success because sometimes success comes with... I mean, this is something I'm sure both of you have noticed, but I've noticed in my life. There's been times when I got the prize and I was like, well, how come nobody told me that this prize came with These things that I didn't expect like, oh, wow, now I have to just like, it's kind of like getting a pool, your dream home, and now it has a big giant yard and a pool and you're like, well, I've never had to take care of a yard and a pool, like, how does that work? And then you're like, I spent all my money on the house and the pool and I don't have money for the The groundskeeper and the pool guy. So I've got to learn to do, you know what I mean? I'm using that as an analogy, but like, I've had a beater where there's been certain things that I got in life that I didn't realize like, oh, there's like a whole new set of unforeseen challenges. and pitfalls that I didn't know I was gonna have to face. I remember when I finally got myself out of debt, I realized, and this is getting a little bit vulnerable, I realized that I had been hiding behind the debt so that I wouldn't have to make some important decisions around my family. And once I cleared the debt, now I had the responsibility of being able to take care of some of the things with my family. And I'm not talking about like my wife and daughter, I'm talking about like, you know, brothers, cousins, parents, sisters, things like that. That I was like, wow, I was able to hide behind the wall of like, well, I have this big debt and like, I can't really help. Now I didn't have that debt anymore. And it's like, wow, now am I, does that make me selfish for wanting to build my wealth over helping that? You know what I mean? Does that make sense? Like there's like these weird nuanced pieces that people don't necessarily tell you that when you get the prize, sometimes it comes with all like, by the way, not only do you get this prize, you get, you have to pay two thirds more in insurance now. Or, you know, or now you don't know who your real friends are. And now like, you know, different things like that. I'm not trying to get all deep and heavy or anything. But where I was going with that is that like, the clarity leads to momentum leads to scale. But just know that sometimes getting what you want Ain't always what you think it was going to be. So enjoy the ride along the way because that's a counterpoint that I would say. There's been a handful of people that I've met and gotten to know well and spent quality time around that on the surface, they're very successful. But they don't, there's a lot missing in their life. They don't have things that would be the case that would, somebody's making like $150,000 a year and they have these other things figured out, they're happier than the person that's making $150 million a year sometimes. Kevin King: I agree. I agree completely. Good stuff, David. This has been awesome. Norm, I think you have a question for David before we let him go. Mike Frekey: I do. Pretty good, Kevin. At the end of every podcast, we ask our guests, do you know a misfit? Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, 100%. I don't even have to think for a second. He's actually the person that I referenced a little while ago that helped me build the brand. He's the person that got me into this industry. He's the person I said that was, you know, earlier when I said he was making millions of dollars selling hypnosis CDs. His name is Michael Lovitch and he is about as true to the word misfit as you can say. He dresses like a homeless person. If you see him at Masterminds and stuff, he's usually making more money than almost anyone there, but he looks like he couldn't afford a cup of coffee. He's hilarious. He's the most loudest, funniest, interesting guy that you would never know has the biggest heart of gold. But I think you'll really enjoy having him on the show if he'll do it, which he'll probably do it. I'll put in a really good word for you guys. Mike Frekey: Okay. Fingers crossed. That sounds fantastic. Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. I hope I didn't over talk there. I'm a big fan of Michael. He's one of my favorite people on the planet. Mike Frekey: No, not at all. Yeah. Kevin King: Not at all, not at all. So David, so 3daythinktank.com or what are other ways? Speaker 1: Iamparty.com like as an internetmarketingparty.com. I want to acknowledge our annual sponsor, I Am Party Digistore that makes it to where if you ever come to a party, you get free drinks, which is awesome. Kevin King: That's awesome. There you go. Appreciate it, David. Thanks for taking some time and sharing. This has been awesome. It's been cool stuff. Speaker 1: Thanks for having me. Kevin King: Keep up the good work.