#363 – Launching Amazon Brands To Exit, Rinse, And Repeat with Kata Phipps

#363 - Launching Amazon Brands To Exit, Rinse, And Repeat with Kata Phipps Speaker 1: Welcome to episode 363 of the AM-PM Podcast. My guest this week is none other than Kata Phipps. She's originally from Chile but living in the UK now. She's got a different perspective than what you're normally going to hear and I really like it. I think she's one of the smartest women in this space, smartest people in this space. And she just doesn't like to work. She likes to so she thinks of everything in terms of how can she do the least to maximize the most. She's already had a seven-figure exit. She's on her way to another seven or eight-figure exit. Now, she actually got her start listening to me on the Seller Sessions podcast. So this is kind of full circle for her coming back on the AM PM podcast. I think you're gonna really enjoy this episode. Let's get it going. And before we do that, don't forget to sign up for the Billion Dollar Sellers newsletter. It's totally free. Comes out every Monday and Thursday. BillionDollarSellers.com. I think you'll find some really good, valuable, actionable tips and strategies in there. Plus, you'll learn a little bit more about me. Enjoy this episode. Unknown Speaker: Welcome to the AM-PM Podcast. Welcome to the AM-PM Podcast, where we explore opportunities in e-commerce. We dream big and we discover what's working right now. Plus, this is the podcast where money never sleeps. Working around the clock in the AM and the PM. Are you ready for today's episode? I said, are you ready? Let's do this. Let's do this. Here's your host, Kevin King. Speaker 1: Kata Phipps, welcome to the AM-PM Podcast. It's an honor to have you here. Speaker 2: Well, it's an honor to be here. Thank you so much for inviting me. Speaker 1: You're someone that I'd heard a lot about for several years through Athena and through some other people and kind of watched what you're doing from afar, but I didn't really get to actually meet you until I went to Seller Sessions. I think like the first time we actually got to spend some time talking. I think we might have met somewhere else briefly, but yeah, I spent some time talking to you like networking bar or something like that and I was thoroughly impressed. I was like, holy cow. This girl is sharp. I mean, I knew she was smart, but like she's like next level up there. So I was like, I got to get her on the podcast and got to get her to come speak at BDSS. This is this is good stuff. Speaker 2: Oh, thank you. Speaker 1: You're welcome. How long have you been in this Amazon game? You've been doing this for a day or two, right? Speaker 2: Well, funnily enough, it feels like a lifetime, but actually September 2018. 2018. How did you hear about this? Speaker 1: What got you into this? Did you see something online? Did you have a friend that was doing it? Looking for an opportunity? Speaker 2: Well, I was bored. You were bored? I was bored and I was poor. Both things are not good. Well, my husband, he at the time was an active wing commander in the Royal Air Force for England and we were stationed in different parts of the world. So being an officer's wife, It's not what it's all painted out to be, and it definitely wasn't my path. So I was pretty bored. I'm a clinical psychologist by trade, but I never really did get to practice I moved from Chile, which is where I was born, to England when I married Matt. Basically, I got to have a lot of degrees and I did a few masters, distance learning. I learned English through doing a master's in English, in psychology as well, during the time that I was following Matt around the world in his postings with the military. It got to the point where I was just thoroughly bored and flower arrangements and dinner and fancy dressing was no longer cutting it for me. Matt comes back home one day, had listened to a podcast on his commute back from Washington. We were living in Maryland at the time in America. And he says, Oh, I listened to this really cool thing about how to sell on Amazon. And I listened to it and I thought, I can do that. And then we started learning through free resources I could consume basically. So I started looking up products and I fell in love with product differentiation and bundling of items that were frequently bought together, which wasn't really a thing back then. But I knew that as I'm a bargain queen and I'm a very good shopper myself, and probably with my psychology background, I sort of had a very good idea of what people were looking for. When coming review, so we just decided to give it a go. So we went into debt and we order our first product and started just, you know, taking it one day at a time and spending several hours house cleaning while listening to podcasts. Speaker 1: Do you remember which podcast that was that he heard originally that set it off? Speaker 2: Yes. So actually, to me, it's a very poignant day because the first ever podcast that I ever listened to was Seller Sessions, the first in-depth conversation that I think it was a two-part, and I remember this so vividly. I was cleaning the floor, polishing the floor with a mop, headphones on, and it was you talking to Danny on Seller Sessions. Speaker 1: It was me. Okay. Speaker 2: And I got to hear everything about your, you know, your day selling calendars and this and that, and I was thoroughly impressed with what you've done. And I thought, gosh, imagine if one day I could be in Seller Sessions as a guest. And then I didn't even think about at the time to ever get to meet you, but then we decided to invest a little more and actually join a network. I'm not sure if I can name it. Yeah, we joined Titan as members and we started learning from the ones that are now my friends. And I thought, my God, these guys, you know, Justin Dyson at the time was the leader and the coach of our group level. Revenue-wise is how it's split out. So we were having these weekly conversations and I thought, oh my God, these guys are so amazing. I need to go to an event and actually meet them. If I'm in the room with them, I'm going to get to pick their brains. So we did. And then I went to China Magic, and then I got to meet Danny, and we became really good friends, and life became a little crazy, really, because everything sort of happened overnight, but at the same time, feels like a long period of time of my life. Speaker 1: That's kind of serendipitous there, isn't it? The podcast you listened to was Cellar Sessions. Now Danny is one of your best friends. He comes and hangs out at your house and you guys do stuff. I know he comes there to decompress and get away sometimes. He's a good guy. Really, really great guy. And then you were listening to me talk and now you're on this podcast. So it's like everything's coming like a full circle. Speaker 2: They were close in the full circle. But you know what? I have lived a life with no regrets. I think that the key to everything we have attained in life is actually that abundance mindset where, you know, a lot of neuro-programming linguistic, if you wish. I always knew I was going to be successful. I just didn't care or worry how. And I believe that if you put in the work and you're humble enough to learn from those that have done it already, you're always going to get somewhere. And that's just how it happened to us. It's not us. It's not our success. We learn from all of you guys in the industry that have done it previously and are kind enough to share your knowledge, which is why we do it now as well through our own means as possible. Speaker 1: Which part of Chile, Santiago or the south or the north or which? Speaker 2: I used to be a city girl from Santiago. Yes. And now I live in the middle of nowhere. But yes, in England, Santiago. Speaker 1: A lot of people don't realize it, but Chile is probably one of the most European Western thinking countries in South America because Argentina has boulevards that look like Paris and stuff because a lot of Italians moved to around the time, a lot of people don't realize this, but around the early 1900s, there's a lot of people coming to the United States from Europe going through stories of Ellis Island. But at the same time, about an equal number of Italians especially were going to go to Buenos Aires in Argentina. And so Argentina has a lot of European influence, but Chile It's probably the most advanced, most Western country in all of South America and a lot of that's because it's a lot of German, heavy German influence there. Speaker 2: Oh yeah, 100%. Speaker 1: A lot of people don't realize you can go around and there's tons of German influence everywhere in the countryside, in the cities and it's a really cool place. For those of you who don't know where Chile is, it's the little skinny one on the far left side of South America that runs what, 3,000 miles from top to bottom or some crazy A mountain like that. But it's everything from the deserts, the Atacama Desert in the north all the way down to Santiago, kind of in the middle. So what's that little city outside of Santiago where you can take a little cable car, all the colorful buildings. Speaker 2: Valparaiso. Speaker 1: Valparaiso. And then down into the south with the volcanoes and everything. And then the very tip of South America, it's amazing. Speaker 2: Patagonia, yeah. Speaker 1: Yeah, Patagonia. It's an amazing, amazing place. So did you meet your husband in Chile? Was he based there or did you meet? Speaker 2: Another serendipity story, which by the way is one of my favorite words. It's kind of funny that you said it, as is the film, cheesy as it is. But yeah, Matt was actually, a couple of friends of his were going on a trip and one of the friends had to call out last minute and Matt jumped in and went in there and a friend of a friend of a friend of mine I was like, Oh my God, these gringos are here. They don't speak any Spanish. I need to take them out because a friend of my brother is back in London. So what do I do? And I'm like, I never go out. I was always a geek psychologist studying and I already had a song. So I was much more mature than all my friends that were, you know, I'm Hangin' Out and Partying. I've worked really hard since a very early age. So I said, I never go out. You can't bail now. Just get the gringos here. They get drunk with one glass anyway. It doesn't matter. We continue chatting. And then she said, well, then I went on. The drinks were flowing. And I didn't speak English. Matt didn't speak Spanish. But then my friend had the idea of saying, If you kiss one of the gringos, I'll pay the bill. And I'm cheap. So I did. And here I am living my best British life. It was really good, actually. We learned each other's languages throughout the years. Eventually, we had a long-distance relationship for about three years, which fitted both of our lifestyles. And then eventually, I suppose, we started running out of money to travel. So we just got married and here I am. Speaker 1: We have a few things in common. I'm going through a divorce right now, but my wife was Colombian, and I met her in Colombia. It's a similar thing. I met her in 2009, I think. I'd gone down there just as a tourist, and the guy that was supposed to take me around couldn't take me that day, so he sent the office girl. She was just like the little office girl. She came and took me, and we did a little trip out on a little snorkeling kind of trip. We just kind of hit it off. Then we went to dinner that night, and nothing happened there. I was like, I'm learning Spanish right now. And I take it in high school and I knew a little bit, but I was like trying to get a little bit better at it. And it's like, I'll come back in a year and I want to be able to speak in Spanish with you for, have a 15 minute conversation in Spanish. And I was just half joking, but you know, half, but, and she held me to it. So like over the course of the next year, so you better be studying your Spanish. You said you're coming back in a year. And then, so I ended up going back a year later. And then we got together and we did long distance for seven years before she moved to the United States. She was studying law at the time. So she wanted to finish her law degree. And so we, then she came to the United States. So yeah, I, so is Matt fluent in Spanish? Your husband? Speaker 2: No, no, but we're just drunk. Speaker 1: And you know, now, now, now, now. Speaker 2: He would love me to say yes, but no, he understands a lot more than he lets on though, you know, but no, Matt does not yet speak fluent Spanish, but he understands some words, which I probably know the best ones very well from when I lose my patience. Speaker 1: I was going to say, I bet there's some Spanish that comes out sometimes when you're, when you're upset about something and he, I think he probably gets the picture pretty quick. Speaker 2: We speak a lot with looks. That's the good thing about Hispanic, Latino, South American people. You can say a lot with just your body. Speaker 1: Your background, you studied psychology, so that's come in probably super helpful in your business because a lot of people don't realize marketing is psychology. If you understand psychology, you have a huge leg up when it comes to marketing. I mean, to market to any kind of business, especially e-commerce, because the fundamental principles, it's not what's the latest hack, what's the latest trick about this. I mean, all those things are cool, but if you don't understand the fundamental psychology of why people do things and how to motivate them to do things, your chances of success turn to luck versus just making it happen. And a lot of people in our business, they have no clue that those two are super closely related. What would you say to people out there that don't realize this? What's something they can do from their business point of view, tying it to the psychology side of things that's given you a major advantage or something that people should be thinking about considering? Speaker 2: So from my trade, I think the fascinating discoveries that I have had through my journey, which I didn't know how it was eventually going to, I thought if I get this going and I get the financial means and I can do psychology or therapy, Like a pro bono type thing. But actually, you're right. And I discovered quite early on in the game that it is very applicable to everything we do in this business. And I will say two things are the most important ones. Number one, be humble enough to understand what the customers are saying. We already get that information for free in the form of reviews if we put in the work to read how the customers are referring to a product, why they're wishing it was better, what they hate about it, what they love about it. All that information is out there. The problem is that I believe, and this is just my personal opinion, as a seller, the more successful you become, the less humble you are to truly remember that ultimately the customer is the one that you are serving. Therefore, you need to listen to what they're saying. Sometimes, probably 80% of the time, the keywords are typing. I know what you would say is the right keyword for that product. If you put in the work and you actually read reviews and you start picking out which now AI can do very easily for you, just those terms that people are using, and even within the U.S. marketplace, several states use different ways to refer to the same product as well, much like it happened in all languages. You can find all of that information right there and truly serve Both the purpose and the emotional conversion, the good feel about any purchase that will ultimately give you the hook to convert that into a sale as opposed to the competition that doesn't care for providing that as an extra bonus. I'm saying not just sell something, not just serve a purpose, but also add that little something that will make them feel good in your copy. About the money they just spent. It really works. It's really that simple to me, at least. And if you don't know how to, then delegate, which is the second part. It's also tied up with being humble enough to realize quite early on in the game what are your goals, what are you really good at, and what you suck at, or what takes away your will to live. For me, it's PPC. I understand it. I am a master. I know exactly what I need to do. I know exactly what I want to do. Do I want to do it for a life? No. I delegate that shit. Straight away, because honestly, life's too short. That's my mantra. So I understand what I'm doing, but delegating is not just about tasking someone with something to do because that creates work for one, right? And I don't want to be spending my time teaching people how to do what I want them to do. I want them to become an extension of me. I want them to learn How my brain operates, how my brain requires reports to be delivered to me so they speak my language. In order to do that, you just have to be a decent human being and understand the interests, the passions, the motivation behind the stuff that you hire. They can become that extension of you and they basically never leave you. So when I sell a brand, my team will never go with that. It's not part of the deal. It's non-negotiable. They wouldn't even go if they were offered triple the money and they have said so and they've been in the spot to be poached and they haven't left because the culture I implement in delegating everything is I value you, and I genuinely do. I care for you. If I have a sale, I will share my financial extra gains with them because they were pivotal to my success, and I never forget that. I'm every morning grateful for having the people I have in my life that contribute somehow to me being able to attain this and make sure that I communicate that regularly, that I am also vulnerable enough to say, I don't actually know the answer. Can you figure it out and then brief me on it? And that means that until I took on the vice-presidency of Titanware recently, I was called by my friends the DNB, which was a title that I proudly carry around, which was the do-nothing bitch, because that's what I wanted to be in life. I wanted to do nothing. I didn't want to do. Speaker 1: That's the way to do it. I mean, that's, that's exactly the way to do is, is figure out what you're best at and what you enjoy. Focus on that and then hire good people and get out of their fucking way. Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely. Speaker 1: And then treat them with respect. Lead as you would want to be led and treat them as humans, not as subjects or something like that, that so many people do or inferior. And I think that's an important thing that a lot of people just don't get. They're like, this is my idea. This is my thing. It was my money. I'm reaping all the rewards when a lot of times you could not have gotten to that point without those people under you to help you. And I always remember when Helium 10, I've known Manny and Guillermo who started Helium 10 back in 2015. When they sold the company in 2019, one of the things that they actually did, which I think is extremely honorable, I think they had like 40 employees at the time. They actually went out and they actually told everybody, I don't know the exact words they said, but they basically said, everybody, what is your debt right now? Not counting your house, your mortgage on your house, but what's your credit card debt? What's your debt for different things? And tell us what that number is. And they paid it all off for everybody. Yeah. And then the programming team was in Serbia. So they flew over to Serbia and spent like a week with these guys, taking them out to dinners and drinking and just having a good old time. And then they changed those guys' lives. I don't know what they gave them, but they gave them enough money where it was life-changing in Serbia for these people. So that's the type of stuff that you've got to do that most people just, they don't get it. They just think everybody's expendable. Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that the people you're referring to are the people that haven't yet attained wealth. And what I mean by this is you can make money and a lot of it. But to me, I remember very vividly the day when I set out my goal, which was to listening to Michelle Benton, who was one of the first women in the industry that managed a big, big exit. This is before aggregator times and all of that. In 2019, and she sold her business for a lot of money and she was very proud on sharing that she managed to build this empire that she's just sold out off, sorry, in five years. And I remember thinking at the time, she did so well, my goodness, what an inspirational woman. I'm going to do that in half the time. And that was my goal. Again, I'm competitive, not going to lie about it. And I did, by the way. But at the moment that we did have our first exit was actually not two and a half years, but it was two years, seven months. The first exit, the first big exit. I'm Generational Wealth. What I thought I was going to do when I had that money and even when I was going to hit the seven figures, I remember so clearly that day I thought, I'm going to be jumping off the walls. I'm going to be celebrating. I'm going to drink champagne. I'm going to go crazy. You know what happened? Something overcame me and I just felt so grounded and I felt that I didn't need Anymore stuff. I didn't need to celebrate. It was just a very profound moment of, this is what happens when you put in the work. And all I could feel was a call to say, how can I go reward those that helped me get here? And for the first time ever, my VA in the Philippines moved out. And as many of you know, because you have staff over there, People leave five families in the same complex, in the same flat or whatever. She was doing so well that people around her neighborhood started spreading comments that she was a sex worker. It was quite funny when she was telling me about this because she had a washing machine that I had. I provided for her as a gift, and then I gave her money so they could buy their own house and live on their own. It was really funny, but you know what? She's still now so thankful for the fact that they are, for the first time in all the generations behind them, living in a place that they can call home of their own. And how beautiful is that with money that we will otherwise spend on a trip, on a fancy holiday for four or five people in a family. It's just so crazy. And it's honestly the biggest joy one could ever receive. And that's what I mean by that's the true wealth. For me, wealth, when you attain wealth is when you're knowledgeable enough to know You don't need the money. What you need is to spread awareness and almost like, I feel like a Jehovah's Witness. Sorry if I offend anyone that I'm knocking on doors saying, Hey, you know, you can do better and you can fulfill all of your dreams. I know you can because I did. Hear me out. This is my story. I feel like I want everybody that care enough to actually put the work in to listen and to do it for themselves. Of course, it doesn't resonate with everybody. It's really easy to dream of it. Not everybody follows through, but that's true wealth. Having the knowledge to replicate what you already attained once It's for me when you really did make it. And that's why I believe those people that you were referring to earlier are not quite there yet. They're still not wealthy even though they have money because they haven't got there. Speaker 1: You're giving me chills. When you were saying that, I had a little chill go down my spine because it resonates with me so much. Everybody, when they're working, they think it's the things. It's nice to go on nice trips. I see your stuff on social media. We go on nice trips. We fly first class or business class or whatever. We do good things. We have nice things, but it's not about those. The things that you buy, you don't take with you when you die. They don't become part of your legacy. It's the stuff that you do for others that becomes part of your legacy and that you're remembered for. And most people forget that. And like you said, you've had, I think a couple exits now, right? But you had the first one, that first big one, you just said it. You were set. You had enough money that you could live the rest of your life and you didn't need to worry. And you're like, what do I do now? I help. Let me help people. Let me give back. And I remember someone years ago was actually a next door neighbor of mine about 20 years ago. He actually said something. He was my landlord of this little duplex I was leasing. And he was an older college professor. I was probably in my early 30s. He was in his 70s or something. And he told me one time, and he'd be out there working on his car in his little garage next to us. And I was talking to him. He said, the best thing you can do when you make it is actually to give back and take care of others. And that's something that A lot of people I don't think really appreciate and they think it's a game like I need more and more money. I need to have 50 million. I need to have 100 million. I need to have The private jet and the private yacht and all that, and it's not really about that. And I think that's an important lesson that people need. You want to make enough money so you have the freedom to do what you want. And like you said, you don't have to do the things you don't want to do. But beyond that, what's more money going to do for you, except create more problems in most cases? Speaker 2: And it was a cliche that I always heard, but the more money you have, the more work you have to put in. Number one, to keep it, and number two, to learn how to invest it, which has been the crash course I've been taking for the last year and a half, trying to work my way around global taxation and a lot of another learning curve. And another thing under the belt to learn is how do we now maximize? How do we start investing? How do we make sure our kids are good and they can actually go on to my son? I'm a very, very academic, orientated person and God blessed me with a sport mom. He plays rugby and an actress, both of which I will always say, Oh my God, you're not going to make a penny in your life. However, they're both fortunate enough to have their parents, so they can go and do the professions they love. It's funny because my 12-year-old actually said, I can afford to be an actress and just do the things I want to do, not to generate money because you guys have money. It was quite funny just how abrupt that comment was, but it actually really opened my eyes. It's like, how beautiful is that to be able to say, I'm really proud of you, son. Go be a teacher. Sad as it is, teachers don't get compensated fairly, but if that's what he wants to do, he can go and coach kids to learn how to play rugby. I know as blessed as we are. It is great and is the biggest joy of success, I will say. It's precisely those moments that don't necessarily go on social media, but that just bring you back a little and say, gosh, this is great. Speaker 1: So how did you orchestrate that first exit? So you started in 2018. You listened to a podcast. You said, I can do this. You started with a few things and you built a brand. What was your goal from day one to have an exit? You said you listened to Michelle or was it you were just trying to make some money to help the family out and to do something and then it became, let me have an exit or what led to that first exit? Was it deliberate or was it built up? Speaker 2: No, when we started, I wanted a side income. And I think I have said this story before, which to some of you might be TMI, but to me, it's actually, it resonates with a lot of people listening, perhaps. I wanted to be able to buy my underwear without having to use the joint account. You know, my husband will know whenever I bought niggers, as we call them here in the UK. Underwear or a bra or whatever, or a birthday present to him that he wouldn't have to see on the statement. I just wanted 500 bucks. That's all I wanted. We didn't really need much more. We weren't like overly privileged like we are now, but we were all doing all right, you know. We could have a simple life. And I wanted to have 500 bucks. So my idea was to start the Amazon thing so I could do it wherever Matt was posted in the future with the military and continue to support his career while I was doing that. And those 500 quickly became 30 grand a month. That was the income I was in where Matt was something in the region of, I don't know, 10 to 20% of that. So it came to a point where we needed to make a decision. And at that time is when I went to China and first learned of the concept of exiting the business. That was one year into our Amazon journey. We hit the seven figures with a very healthy profit margin at 10 or 11 months into our Amazon journey. Speaker 1: How many products was that? How many SKUs was that? One SKU? And what category? Speaker 2: Kids. Speaker 1: Kids? Okay. Go ahead. Sorry. Speaker 2: Or it was toys and games. Yeah. So we're a little bit crazy and it's not what we teach, just so you all know, because this is just a very personal journey. And one of the first thing once you do is just to know what kind of game you want to play. And I'm a bit of a lunatic and I get bored really easily. So I knew that I needed rapid growth or else I was just going to move on to something else. So, we only ever launch million-dollar products and that's how my friends know me, the million-dollar SKU lady, because I never have launched a product that haven't hit the seven figures so far. So, we sold our brand with only five SKUs for multi-seven figures because it did really well. Speaker 1: Sold to an aggregator or a strategic buyer? Speaker 2: We sold to Unaggregated. Speaker 1: That was 2020, I guess? Speaker 2: That was 2021. 2021. Okay. Yes. So most of my friends by then, as I said, they had 150 SKUs that were making the same money. So I was working literally One, 150% while they were working because although I had a lot of risk, my products have such demand that we just, we had different problems. The problem of cashflow, the problem of running a business in the USA, but being British nationals, therefore we couldn't get lending in the UK nor in the US because we weren't citizens or a business established in either country. It was very difficult to grow on that respect, but we just took chances. And we made it happen. But yes, that's sort of how the journey became to be. I'm multi-seven-figures. And at that time, I remember really when I decided that I wanted to sell because it's your baby. Everybody sells their brand, not wanting to let it go because it's their baby. And I remember at the time, a lot of people in podcasts will say, don't get emotionally involved with your product. Just do and repeat and replicate. Don't get emotionally attached. And I thought, no, actually, you need to get emotionally attached because you need to be able to convey the message. You need to be able to serve the avatar you've chosen and your niche thoroughly. So you have to be proud to be able to say out loud, I'm the owner of this brand and this is what we do and check it out. What do you think? I respect everyone that does the, I'm going to launch and if 80% of it sticks, cool. And the other 20% are Rinse and Repeat or what have you. That's also very good. It's just not how I want it to operate. I wanted to work very little and I want to return fast. So we start with that method, but we did have a lot in line and therefore Q4, having $800,000 worth of inventory in the hands of Amazon became really scary. This is at the time when we only had two SKUs and we needed to sell two and a half mil worth of products during Q4 and I was literally like, what if Something happens overnight and they take me down for three months. I always had a plan of how I was going to shape the inventory not to get, you know, I'm always like Mrs. Potato Head. I'm always ready for doom day, but because that allows me to sleep despite my crazy, but, um, but it wasn't ideal. So I started thinking, okay, well, if I sit down now, that when the aggregator model came to the table and I have conversations, not just they're going to do a free audit of my businesses will otherwise cost me 20K to 60 according to who I'm going to go with. I remember speaking with Northbound at the time and they were really good, really thorough and will put a really nice plan together for me. But It will cost me what it's worth, which is all that work. And again, I'm cheap, so I didn't want to do it. So I listened to some of Scott's free classes instead. And I prepared my exit with his paradigm and just follow what he does. And he was so good at teaching how he does it that I didn't need to hire him. So I didn't go with a broker. I went in myself. And I sat at the table with a few aggregators. And they audited my business and they audited my books and then we sold to one and that was it. Basically how it happened. And I took the money off the table. So cool. I'm Reinvest. And at that time, I was at the same time launching the second brand, which also did very well and still doing very well. Speaker 1: So the second, have you had one exit or have you had two exits? Speaker 2: I have had one exit and I have now three brands, one which I'm launching next month. So I have two brands that I'm I'm very excited for one's doing really well. But we don't really work on it. The team does it all. It's magic. It's our magic. We delegate very well. They are all super excited for it. We consult with them. It's a very small team, five people. That's all there is to our mastermind company umbrella. And we just rinse and repeat. And we know what to do. We know who to work with. And we do it over and over again. And that's what we're doing. But it's only now for the first time this year that I'm actually going in a different direction and taking some You know, sitting on the student's chair and going into a different category and just doing it all over again from scratch. Speaker 1: You can't do anything in the children. You probably have a non-compete or is that maybe for a few years in children? So this is in different categories, right? Speaker 2: Well, there isn't much I can disclose about, but it is within the category because I'm a very good negotiator. But yeah, it's not competing keywords. Speaker 1: Okay. Is the plan to actually sell these at some point as well? Are you building these to sell from the ground up? Speaker 2: Yep. My plan is always the same. I like to work with the mighty but yet small. I don't have I don't need the title of I run an eight-figure business. I have an eight-figure business. You know why? Because that's corporate and I don't like that. I like personalized family vibes. I like to get to know my people, work with them. I don't want to scale beyond that. It's too much work. I don't want to tap any other marketplaces. I've never sold anywhere that's not America. I'd just rather become a master of one thing very well Left the rest on the table for whoever wants to take it to the next level because it's a vanity title. So I might as well just get the money out of the table and do it again several times and it just works. It fits what I want. It makes me happy. Speaker 1: You're US only, right? That's what you just said. So you're not selling, you're not doing any, all these people that say you need to diversify and go into other marketplaces or sell on Shopify or go to Walmart. You're just Amazon and Amazon only. Speaker 2: Yes, I don't believe, I believe that you can do it all. I don't want to. I don't need to. And I don't believe that one should, I mean, everybody gets into this game because they want the freedom that it You know, in markets, right? It's like, oh, get your freedom. And everybody changes their 9 to 5 for a 9 to bloody 9. That's the true life of an Amazon seller, you know, and I don't want that. So if I go on to this big corporate thing, I have to hire more people and I have to oversee more people and I have to stop being the visionary, which is what I am. And I have to stop doing what I love, which is creating hands-on With my product, I'm working really hard on product R&D and differentiating the heck out of them. So I actually have a proposition that brings value for the same money that the current offer. It's providing customers. So I'm not scared of competition, of market density and all of that because I know I know how to read the customers and if I can provide something better through my contacts that I gathered throughout the years, whether it be in sourcing more efficiently, cutting costs where it needs to and just staying lean, then I can offer the customers for the same price something so much better. What's not to love? Of course, it's going to work in my books. Well, it has not worked so far, so I'm going to touch wood just now, just in case. But yeah, that's basically how I want to do it. So yes, the method is, you know, just flying over the eight figures and write them, then get and take the money out of the table and rinse and repeat. Speaker 1: So what do you think is going to happen? You sold to an aggregator at the peak of the aggregator time in 2021 when multiples were getting out of hand and crazy. That stuff has all come down now. So do you have a little bit different approach in how you're looking at the exit for this one since that market has kind of changed or is everything still the same? Speaker 2: No, no. To be honest, I don't have any different strategies. Of course, we did benefit of being able to have that experience. However, I don't believe that the multiple that we attained was crazy. It was actually what I thought it was worth. We might have done a little bit better upfront than others would do now. But the truth is, if you run a very lean company, And you are very aware and you have the education behind you on your numbers, which is the most important thing. Everybody just at the time, especially focuses a lot about revenue, revenue, revenue, seven figures, whatever. And the contribution margins are shit. Like the actual net is nothing. So now my goal in the people I coach and with the people I work is, is just From day one, you can actually be in the green. There is no longer a need to just go on to minus 10,000 being month three of a launch and still think it's going to work because it's not necessary. There are other things that you can put into place. Not just on the delegation stage, but also the educational aspect of what do your numbers are telling you? What are your actual KPIs? What are your systems? Everybody thinks that you get to be successful and then you implement systems and that's wrong because by then it costs you a shit ton of money to bring in talent. If you hire people early, you can actually imprint the blueprint of your company and your business ways if you wish into them a much cheaper price if you hire potential rather than talent and learn together. And that's how I build my team based on potential, not necessarily talent. Because it was cheaper, and it continues to be cheaper. I still hire potential over talent when I can. So I'm not doing anything different. I know exactly what The number is that I'm going to let it go for, and that we just reverse engineer. This is the number we're going to let that brand go for, and this is what we're going to do at every stage, and this is how many SKUs we're going to need, and these are the number of sales a day that we're going to have, and this is the average price, and this is how much we can afford to have our cogs at. We just keep it simple that way, and it just works. Speaker 1: I hope everybody out there listening is paying close attention to what she's saying because this is the way that you do it and you get the freedom and the lifestyle that you want. It's not what most gurus and most other people are teaching. And this is, it may be counter to what you've been taught or what you believe, but she's living proof, Kata's living proof of it. And she's telling me exactly how to do this. And it's music to my ears because you don't hear this very often. And it's the same thing that I've always said. People are like, Kevin, you're teaching all this, but you're not a nine-figure seller. You're not even an eight-figure seller. I've sold eight figures online, but you're not an annual eight figures per year. You're seven figures. Do you feel inferior or something to some of these other people? There's other people in the space bragging about they're doing 30 million, 50 million a year, whatever. And I'm like, no, not at all. I probably actually know more than they do. And I'm living a different and better life and being able to do what the heck I want I don't have all those headaches. You're really good on the systems and stuff. I'm really good on the partnering with people. People are like, Kevin, how many VAs do you have? You have all these different things you do on Amazon from the podcast to your newsletter to the products that you're selling. You're still selling, right? Yeah. Speaker 2: It's very good by the way. I'm subscribing. I have totally enjoyed it. So I recommend everybody to subscribe too. Speaker 1: Thank you. To the training that I do, I partner smart. And so I don't, that's more of my things. And I'm not trying to create more work or to create, you know, there's only a certain amount of money that you need. You know, my number is, and I'll, you know, I've made, I make good money, but my number, if I have an exit is 10 million. If I have $10 million in the bank and I just properly invest that, not crazy invested, but properly invest that, you can live off of, if it's say it's 400 grand a year, you should be making more than that in interest in return. I can live off that comfortably and then do what the hell I want, take care of other people, help other people out like you have. And that's my whole philosophy. I don't need a private plane. I don't need a yacht. I don't need a $50 million mansion. If I want to splurge and apply business class, I'll splurge. I have the money to do it. But that's key in what she's saying. And I think another key that if you haven't been listening closely to what she's saying is she has, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think one of your major competitive advantages is customer empathy. And the way that you can get into their head, some of that's a psychology background, some of that's what you said, where you're analyzing everything, but actually knowing and listening. The customer is not always right. Despite that slogan that people say, customers are always right, do what they say, that's actually not true. But you've got to learn how to listen to the customers and how to actually segment the customers. You have people buying from you that maybe you don't want buying from you. Sometimes you've got to fire customers. But if you can figure out how to carve out who those passionate people are and then find more of those and not worry about the others, it can make a huge, huge difference. And I think that's some of what you're kind of saying that you're doing and why you can be successful and sleep at night with having just a few SKUs doing crazy seven figures per year, knowing that this is your moat and you're not worried. Speaker 2: Yeah, well, obviously, the first Exit gave me that mode. I needed that. I needed to save that money off the table just to make sure that my family will be taken care of regardless of what will happen in the future. But the reason we went back into Amazon is, number one, because it continues to be the biggest opportunity of our time to generate financial income. If you do it right, quite rapidly, I don't think there is anything else, not even investment, that you can generate that much, that quickly. We have, however, also put an awful lot of work after our exit, and this is probably going to resonate a little bit more with more of the higher roller sellers as you have in your circle. But putting the education as well onto what to do with the money to invest in, I always remember... I don't remember exactly who said it, but they said that when you have the money, you need to make sure that 20% goes into this, 20% goes onto that and this and that and just sort of split. And a lot of people believe that splitting your Amazon marketplaces or splitting Amazon, Shopify and Walmart, for instance, is what not having all the eggs on the same basket means, but what it What that to me actually means, not having all the eggs in the same basket, is take your money off the table. It doesn't matter if it's not the vanity number that you believe at that time that you need to call yourself as or be introduced when you speak at a gig or whatever, when you're on a podcast. Take that money, learn, listen to other people and do the following. Put 20% into real estate. It's not going to grow exponentially. It's going to be like a 6% a year or what have you, but it's going to be growth and it's going to be safe. Then put the other 20% in another type of investment with a higher return, may work, may not work. Don't do crypto. We lost 50K on that, but that's a different story, but it's okay. Speaker 1: Sometimes you got to take risks, but you had the money to risk. Speaker 2: So long you're good with that money never being seen again, your life not changing, go for it. And then put all the 20%. Right now, for instance, I'm investing on different kinds of things. We're doing a roll-up for some home-based services in the US in one way. I'm flying off to Chile on Monday because I fell in love with a flat and I ended up buying nine. And now I've been learning about Airbnb hosting and I want to provide an experience and I've been working with people and teaming up with people and calling my friends with money and getting them onto the project and we're doing that, which is amazing and I'm super excited for. And then I'm doing the brands on the other hand, then I'm working with Tyson and teaching the leaders how to coach people and working with Dan and Athena and trying to get this vision to change more people's lives. And then ultimately, which is my passion project, is I'm going into a category that I said I never was going to go into, which is the supplement one. So I'm going to be very open about it because much like my whole life, this was serendipity. I was jumping on a plane to go see my mother, who is 59 years old and she's in the late stages of early onset dementia and Alzheimer's disease. So sadly, she had a She had a rough and it started when she was only 52. I, by the way, have the same gene. So that's why also I am motivated to live my best life now before I forget. So just in case in 10 years time I become my mother, I'm going to have lived my best freaking life and I'm going to have changed as many lives as I can. And that's such of my passion. But I was going on this trip. I was really struggling. I was, I was successful. She didn't get to see that. I had made it. She didn't get to see that. I can only buy her clothes for her. She's bedbound has been for two years. That's been It doesn't move. She just is. It's terrible. It's heartbreaking, and it takes away all the joy of any successes one could have. And as I'm boarding my plane, which, by the way, I only got to because friends such as Danny and Ferris and some people you know that are my very close friends were cheering on me through WhatsApp, you got this. Get on that taxi. Go. I didn't want to see her. I didn't want to face the fact that my mom was going to die or she was no longer the person I left before COVID. So. I got there and as I'm boarding, this guy that I once met years ago that I mentioned something about me being on the e-commerce world or starting to be on from Chile says, hey, I have a friend who is a Nobel Prize nominee doctor and he is very old and he saw his first pharmaceutical testing and stuff to catch by a blood test early onset dementia and frontotemporal cognitive decline. But to big pharma and he regrets it because he never really took off. It's too expensive for people and he now has a solution which is a preventative supplement for cognitive decline. 20 years of clinical study, peer reviews, patented, FDA approved everything and he needs a contact for e-commerce. That honestly happened when I was boarding that plane to see my mother. So I got off the plane in Santiago. And the first thing I did, I went to meet with this doctor. And I thought, this is the universe telling me this is my passion project. Whether it works or not, I'm going to do it. So I took it on. And now we're going to launch the heck out of it. And we have I have poured every ounce of my body on reading just about every single peer-reviewed journal that explains the science behind this compound and all the difference from what already exists out there for brain and focus and memory and whatnot. This is different. This is something that I can relate so highly with, and I believe in through my background, obviously, and peer review on my geeky scientific part. And I'm going to put it to the masses because you know what? If one person, it doesn't cure, it doesn't mean that it's not going to happen. What it does truly is that it delays the onset of it. So if you tell me that it's going to delay my onset of any kind of cognitive decline two decades, I'm on it. And if that happens to just one person and never get to hear about it, at least I'm going to die happy because I think it's going to be a revolutionary. And again, I'm going against whatever I said and whatever everybody tells you about the category and whatnot. And I know nothing about supplements. The truth is I had to learn everything this year, but I think we're now in a very good place and I have gained another skill set. And this is one that follows my heart. So we'll see how it goes. I hope that by the time we're in Hawaii, I can tell you. I hit the seven figures again. Even though that's secondary to the actual thing, just to be able to do something that means a little more than just sales, to me, I'm just so fortunate, to be honest. That's going to be exciting. Speaker 1: That's incredible, actually. That's very honorable. Very, very incredible. Congratulations on that and keep that up. We need more people like you out there. Speaker 2: Well, congratulate me when people buy it and I manage to convey the message. Speaker 1: No, but like you said, though, even if it helps one person, even if this product doesn't work, it doesn't fail, if it helps one person you don't even know, You've done a very good thing for the world. And that's what matters. And you're in a position to actually do that, to help perfect strangers out. And I think this will do... Is there a patent on it? Or is there any protection on it? Or can people knock you off if it takes off? Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I'm Ruthless. I pattern and copyright even my listing, PDF print, copyright absolutely everything. As I said, I'm Mrs. Potato Head. Before you hit me with an infringement, I got you three cease and desist letters and a copyright number. Ready to go. Because I do the work beforehand. That's the thing. You need to be prepared, you know, and it's going to be, these guys are not going to be happy. So I'm ready to go for it. But you know, much like with everything, you need to... IP is so important, especially when you're putting the work to differentiate something, whether it be a design or whatever, you need to be aware of what is the worst case scenario and prepare for that one. And then you can sleep at night. Or your worst case scenario is that Amazon mistakenly took you down. Have the letter at the ready. There's thousands of free templates out there. Just prepare one. Have it ready to go. You know, do the work beforehand. Don't be reactive. Prepare for things. And that's what I mean by reverse engineer. I'm Everything. What can go wrong? What can I be hit with? Okay. Is it going to be a matter of like now Q4, right? What's going to happen? Is Amazon not going to check in your inventory? Is your fulfilled by merchant at the ready? Have you go source out your 3PL? Because guess what? People will buy you anyway. They don't care where it comes from. They just want to get the present purchase. Just have a plan. Have a plan for whatever that can go wrong and then you can chill and just action that and have the team at the ready. Document everything and ask questions, but ask questions with data. Don't go on Facebook and say, hey, Amazon took down my listing. What can I do? Don't say why. Don't say what they actually did, what have they attempted already, what hasn't worked, and don't provide any data whatsoever. If you ask informed questions, people like you, Kevin, I'm sure you will be able to actually give a meaningful answer. But these people are happy to just buy the training or listen to the podcast and feel like they made it. And it's not. If you don't action it, you didn't really do it, did you? So it's that. It's putting the work and prepare before so you can chill and just let it work. There is no more magic to that. Plan your systems. Write the description of the roles that you're once going to need. We all chat. We, you know, are hiring documents on what the role should be and how you're going to measure and where they're going to learn how to do things. Be sharp about what's free out there. Dang it, just send me a DM and I'll send you the whole thing. I don't care. That's why I build it for, to share, you know, but do something, take action. Don't just listen without doing a thing. That's, that's for me, it's being truly the key of how this rapid growth has happened to us. Speaker 1: You're going to be in Hawaii in May of next year at the Billion Dollar Seller Summit. What are you looking forward to on that? You're one of the keynote speakers at the Billion Dollar Seller Summit in Hawaii. You've never been before. Speaker 2: I have never been. Speaker 1: What are you looking forward to or what do you think what's in store? Speaker 2: Well, what's in store obviously is a lot of fun. I love now working with people though. It's funny because I don't really like I don't really like crowds and I don't really like many people. But the ones I do like, if I'm talking to you, you know, it's because I want to. That's one thing you're never going to get when you see what you get with me. But I look forward actually when I'm in this environment to see good, kind-hearted people, to get to brainstorm. I very rarely speak about Amazon itself or tactics or hacks and things like that because that's what I do with the people that I coach. You know, with my friends, when we are strategizing, you know, content creation and whatnot. So I just like to engage and get to know the real person. Like, I love to have learned about how you met your wife today. That's the kind of conversation I look forward to most in these events because I love to learn about little things behind it. I believe friendship is very hard to come by at our age, especially in this industry. But when you do get a few good ones, they are I'm Keepers. I'm very blessed to have swapped all the friends who my success didn't really resonate with that much and they sort of fizzled away from us to ones that are really rooting for us and really happy and allow us to be unapologetically successful and inspiring because that's also a journey. And I'm not going to tell you just yet what I'm going to be speaking about, but I'm hoping it's going to be a very holistic view of how to attain your Amazon success and beyond, which I don't think many people talk about really. We still focus a little bit on the hacks are really fun. I learned from them all, but that's not what you're going to get from me. You're going to get hacks for life, I think. Speaker 1: That's awesome. Whatever they are, I know they're going to be awesome. It's been great speaking with you today. I've really enjoyed our conversation here. It's been really cool. If people want to know more about you or follow you or see what's up, is there a good way to do that? I don't know if they want to get involved. With Titan or with anything else that you're doing or follow your journey, you said you might be making this supplement thing a little bit more public or something. What's the best way to do that? Speaker 2: Yes, I'm going to be documenting my life as a dementia carer. That's something I'm working on at the moment, just bringing vulnerability back to the table and talk about things. Not many people talk about, but yeah, Instagram Kata Phipps or katatitanmembers.com. If you want to learn anything about how to systemize, if you want SLPs or charts, whatever resources I have, I'm always super willing to give them to you. Just hit me up, give me a couple of days and I go back to you. But yeah, it's, it's been great. And I truly hope that someone can resonate that, you know, if I did it, On the cheap for free. So can you because it's, you know, it's a proven concept and I think it's a really cool one and you're going to get amazing friends along the journey as well, which is priceless in itself. So hundred percent. Speaker 1: Thanks again, Kata. It's been really, really great to having you here on the AM PM Podcast. Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. Speaker 1: With that approach, and I think it's actually one of the better approaches that you can take. A little bit difficult for some people to get their head around, but it's a great approach. She and I could have kept talking for quite some time. That hour went really quick. I hope you enjoyed this episode. We'll be back again next week with another awesome episode. Got some really cool stuff coming for you. Be sure to sign up if you haven't yet for the Billion Dollar Sellers newsletter, BillionDollarSellers.com. And before we leave today, I've got some words of wisdom for you. How you do anything is how you do everything. Remember, how you do anything is how you do everything, especially when people aren't looking. See you again next week.